Sunday, November 25, 2012

This is a very rare photo.  It must have been taken in the 1940's, judging from the dress the lady in the photo is wearing.  I have no other information on it. 
A big THANK YOU to Backporch Jurgend for finding this jem and allowing US to borrow it.
Hi Skynyrd,
I saw your picture of Spahn Ranch back in the 40's on your website, and thought I'd send another your way.  This one is from the late 50's I believe.  It's an old photograph, but I tried to take a decent picture of it, so you could see it. 

Hope you had a nice Thanksgiving.
My Best, JimNY
Thanks Jim... Cool  Photo.


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...




Kimchi said...

Hope your 'puter gets well soon, I know the feeling...

MrPoirot said...

The sign says TV which may indicate the early 50s. That isa large sedan by the boardwalk that doesnt look 4os-like. That big square sedan style may be early 50s too. Spahn bought the ranch in 48. Also I am curious if Santa Susanna rd was a dirt road then. It looks recently scraped.

I haven't a clue but could that be a relative of Spahn's? She doesn't look doneup like an actress.

There's only two boulders in front of the boardwalk. Gearge would have been about 61-63 years old at the time of this pic. I think the ranch became slowly run down as George aged. He was possibly unable to afford improvements as time passed.

katie8753 said...

Thanks Kimchi.

She looks like a typical Mom back then. Hand made dress with A-line pockets and white heels. Small waist black belt, black stitching around the neck and sleeves, On vacation with her family to a local landmark and had her picture taken....notice the cross to her right.

MrPoirot said...

It is also possible that the woman is a tourist judging by her high heels. She doesn't look like she is their for horse riding.

sunset77 said...

Katie said "notice the cross to her right", that "cross" appears to me to be the circular handle of a water valve sticking up out of the ground.

Thanx for the pic.

Unknown said...

I agree with Poirot. I also think his declining health played a huge factor in the ranch becoming run down.

Unknown said...

Maybe its George's wife Martha? The thing is on her grave I can't read her death date. It could be either 1936 or 86.

MrPoirot said...

I'd never heard George's wife's name before.
She could have died in 36 when George ran a dairy farm in Pennsylvania. If so, Gearge would have been in his early forties then. I heard he had 8 or 10 kids.

Unknown said...

I went to findagrave and found her grave with George's. She died in 1986. Thats strange, cause clearly she wasn't living at the ranch then? I wonder where her whereabouts were when the Family lived there.

MrPoirot said...

That's a blast. I've read very little about George. She must have come to California with him. I doubt they saw one another much because Squeaky would have been jealous.
What else do you know about George? Why do you think the lady in the pic may be his wife? What was his wife's birth date?

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Any computer tech-types out there?

My computer boots-up and operates in "safe mode"... but that's it.
If I try to start the computer in regular mode, it boots-up completely... and then shuts off.
Great huh? LOL

I've deleted 12 gazillion files from my desktop, thinking this might be a memory space issue... no such luck.
I've dumped every file, document, photo, and video onto an external hard-drive... no improvement.

Oddly enough... I also have no audio.
When I run the diagnostics, it doesn't solve the audio problem either.

The computer says to start each program (while in safe mode) until you find the problematic program (through a process of elimination).
I'm not too optimistic about that idea. LOL

Any suggestions, besides the obvious... which is break down, and buy myself a new computer for Xmas? : )

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

On the upside... for some strange reason... everything is much bigger online in "safe mode"... the pages, avatars, print, everything...

No need for glasses. LOL!

MrPoirot said...

Go to Recovery and select an earlier date.

MrPoirot said...

click start
at the bottom search area enter r-e-c-o-v-e-r-y
select an earlier date to restart

Kimchi said...

Martha Spahn is buried next to George, I've been there a few times...

I was told that Martha lived in the house on the back ranch, west of the movie's still there..

Can't remember if they were divorced or why she lived there and not with George ...

Maybe josh remembers and will fill us in...

Unknown said...

She was born in 1895.

MrPoirot said...

Lynyrd to change the size of your screens default font go to "Monitor Settings" and choose the origonal default setting.
Again, just click Start and enter Monitor Settings in the Search space at the bottom.

Anonymous said...

George and his wife both lived at the ranch. It sounds better if he isn't married and just foolin around with Charlie's girls. Funny how they erased her from history in regards to TLB.
I've heard from many that she was at the ranch and involved with the ranch business, so she had to know Charlie and the girls and their friends.
Maybe things weren't how they're portrayed........

Anonymous said...

BackPORCH JUgEnD!!!!

Kimchi said...

Thanks Lauren!!

Kimchi said...

Thanks Josh!!! Didn't Martha live in that old house in back that's still there? The one with the old truck or tractor (junk) and a swing or whatnot?

Anonymous said...

I think so, yes.
They really split the ranch up after the fire and Spahn left.
The church runs most of it, like nazis I might add, while another piece is monitored by some freak on a golf cart. The part of the ranch where the movie set was, as well as where Tex stayed down by the creek are part of the state park system.

MrPoirot said...

I knew George went home at 5pm everyday as did Ruby but never knew where either lived. I think I heard George went with Ruby to Oregon and stayed at her ranch there.
I never knew George lived at the old ranch house. I thought it was the old place with mattresses on the floor. It was 1/4 to 1/2 miles from the movie set.The Family would have meetings there.

Anonymous said...

Don't quote me, because I'm not 100 percent I remember correctly
I think Spahn sold what was left of his ranch to Frank Retz or some group affiliated with Retz. Spahn moved to Oregon where he bought a ranch and lived, along with Ruby Pearl and his wife. The ranch was run or owned, I'm not sure which, by Retz until his untimely demise driving into a culvert 'cause his bridge disapeared. A friend of mine had many dealings with Retz and said that he was a grade A asshole. After Retz took the plunge the Ranch was in part, the Manson part, taken over by the state. The rest of it was somehow aquired by a church. I have had dealings with the church and they don't like tourists. :) They also blow up rocks that they believe were associated with Manson. They also ride around on golf carts patrolling for Manson tourists. They're a fun loving bunch........not really though. They're kinda creepy

Anonymous said...

That map, drawn by good ol' stabby Tex, has led me to many cool relics at the old movie set/ranch site. The whole thing is there, all burned up and buried.

katie8753 said...

Thanks Jimmy! I hope you had a good Thanksgiving too. :)

Kimchi said...

Ahhhh....the Golf Cart Guy....someone I'd rather he did tell us the FBI had been there "with the dog guy" digging around which aired not too much later on the Discovery Channel, which I now have by the way...

sunset77 said...


Computer problems can be a pain, there are some vids on YouTube that explain some things about "Safe Mode", they may not help much though.

Once I had to re-install Windows, I may have done a "repair install". If you still have the Windows disc that came with your computer, that may be an option. I just put the disc in, and followed the instructions, I think for "repair install". There was a long code number on a sticker on the side of my computer I had to type in, I had to read it with a magnifying glass. After I got back online I started getting "automatic updates", it took like 4 days to get back where I was, but it has worked ever since.

Another option may be to take your computer to an expert. I'd be careful which "expert" you pick because there are many scammers. My computer is basically a "homemade" built by a shop ran by a woman. I've talked to her, she routinely takes info (pix, data, programs) and transfers it to another computer, then erases the infected computer, and puts the info back until she finds the problem. She put a completely new hard drive in my neighbors computer for $150 and saved all his pix, programs, etc.

An "expert" can probably fix your computer, I don't know how old it is or if it's worth it. I would recommend taking it to a shop with people you trust if you know of any.

Anonymous said...

Golf Cart Guy needs a job. He has 3 of those frickin golf carts and spends his days monitoring for tourists.
They were looking for dead babies at Spahn. They used bulldozers and all, tax dollars at work, looking for things that they never found. Buster, at least from what I've seen, has not really found very much.

Unknown said...

Ugh I hate when awesome good tourist sites fucked up. Why would a church want to own it if they knew it belonged to the Manson family anyway?

OH okay I need someone's advice. For Christmas I want a Manson family related book to ask my parents for but I don't know which one. I've never read Helter Skelter or any of the books.

Anonymous said...

Get Helter Skelter just so you can know what's in it and what everyone is talking about and, in my opinion, spring for the Schrek book. They're opposite sides of the same subject and give an interesting contrast.
The church makes a point of running people off the ranch, even the state owned part of it, and they destroy any relics, such as "the music rock" that they find. It's all very odd, but entertaining to see them flip out when one shows up to check out the old site of Spahn Ranch.

MrPoirot said...

Schreck kinda bums me out. Scares me. He has trouble with telling fact from rumor. He lumps them all together. Some investigative leads are dead ends but not to Schreck. He will mix gas and water and tell you they blend evenly.

Helter Skelter is Bugliosi's book but the editor Curt Gentry made it a page turner. It's a very long book. You won't know Gentry is there. He just makes it easy to devour. Bug is kinda dry if you read his other books.
There are probably 20 interesting books on TLB. The Family by Ed Sanders is a page turner too. You can also get the Manson73 video by Robert Hendrickson. That documentary is a must. Hendrickson took cameras to Spahn Ranch when much of the Family still lived there after the murders. Even Clem and Bruce Davis were still living there.

Anonymous said...

I believe that your statement on the Schrek also describes the Bug nicely too.
The Family is good, but you must watch out for FAR OUT conclusions and the always annoying oo-ee-oo

Another good book would be Squeaky by Jess Bravin.
My advice would be to read more than one and to try and read up on the different perspectives to all this info.
There's a lot out there.
It seems that some people tend to only read the books that fit their opinion on events......for instance: :)
Matt, a person who also blogs, seems to have gotten his panties in quite the bunch over this whole Schrek subject.

In the end, I think, it's best to have as much info as possible. Then you can come to your own conclusions. Also, it makes for a well rounded discussion on Lynyrd's blog!!!! :)
Hope all are well today!!!
Off to CONQUER!!!

Anonymous said...

Poirot is dead on.....documents are a must...Hendrickson also has a second doc. and a book out. Both are interesting

Anonymous said...

Hi Lauren. For enjoyment, Jess Bravin's "Squeaky" is a great read, like Josh says. ...Sadie's book is pretty good too.

HS & The Family are cheap enough and widely available 2nd hand to get yourself later. The good thing about HS is that it lays it all out sequentially IIRC. Simon Wells' "Coming Down Fast" is not bad. ...And most of the other tomes in the Manson canon are poor reads.

MrP. is right that the original Hendrickson film is a must, at some point.

And...if you're considering the Schreck, have a good think about whether you really want to pass your (or your parents) address along to him or whoever handles his shipping, and whoever they might pass their database of buyers details on to in the future.

Otherwise...if they're worriers, give your folks a break and don't ask for a Manson title.

Unknown said...

My parents are well aware of my fascination for years haha. I have a funny story. In 5th grade which was when my fascination started after seeing the E! True Hollywood Story on Sharon Tate, I dressed up as a hippy for our elementary school parade. I put an X on my forehead and to my surprise my teacher who was only 40 knew and called my mom. Woops!
I always wanted to read Helter Skelter but Col Scott's hatred for the book always made me disinterested

Anonymous said...

t's good to read Helter Skelter just to know what everyone's talkin about. There are a lot to choose from. I think the ones mentioned here are all good ones.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hi Lauren,

"Helter Skelter" by Bugliosi, is a good way to acquaint yourself with names and timelines.
It covers a little bit of everything... unlike some books which focus primarily on Manson (or one player), specifically.
Although the motive contained within Bugliosi's book, has long been disputed... it will acquaint you with all the people, places, and dates.
Barring the never-ending "motive dispute", you'll get a good dose of everything (and everyone) in Bugliosi's book... and consequently, you'll become pretty well-versed.
The downside:
It's a pretty dry read.
So much so... I had a hard time finishing it.
I skipped around a lot, and skipped a few sections completely. LOL
It reads like an encyclopedia... and that's basically, how I use it.
If someone asks a tough question, I often refer to Bugliosi's book (as I would the dictionary, during a scrabble game).
If you reference a page and quote from Bugliosi's book, that's usually proof-positive for most folks... regarding dates, places, court proceedings, etc... (everything other than motive).

"The Family" by Ed Sanders is another staple.
It's a bit sensationalized, as Sanders is an artsy-fartsy musician/poet type.
Sanders is actually (in my estimation) more of a poet, than a true crime author.
The bottom line:
Sanders' poetic hippie background, make this book a fun read.
Sanders makes you feel like you're at the ranch.
He paints a lot of scenes (and scenarios) a bit bigger than life.
He builds-up each character with detailed descriptions... and he intersperses humor.
In a nutshell:
You will feel the heat and smell the horse-shit, when Clem is shoveling the horse stalls.
You will become enamored by some characters and scenes... and absolutely repulsed by others.
The book reads like a story, not a manual of facts.
Taken with a grain of salt, it's probably one of the easier reads.
I found it not only very informational, but enjoyable.

Book #1 (Bugliosi's) is written by a lawyer.
Book #2 (Sanders') is written by a poet.
That pretty much sums-up what you can expect inside each.
Your personality, should dictate the rest.

Now for my practical fatherly advice:
There's so many copies of these two books floating around... you can easily grab a copy of either, at your local library.
I've never checked, but you can probably get used copies (of either) on Amazon for $8.
If you get Sanders' book, get the latest issue (with the red cover).

Here's a book I always recommend, on a related topic:
Buy "The Electric Kool-Aid Acid Test" by Tom Wolfe.
Hands-down the best book I've ever read!
If you don't love it, I'll eat my hat. LOL!
But, Trust me... you'll LOVE it!
(Another book that any decent library should have on the shelf).

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Thanks Poirot and Sunset for your computer advice.

I tried your idea first.
Problem is... my computer is only offering me three recovery date options, and they're all within the last week... not much help.
I tried the oldest date... no improvement.
There's a check box, which says: "load more dates", but it's not working.
It's pretty F#ck-ed. LOL

I'm pretty much down to the "Recovery Disc", as you suggested.
Problem is... I hesitate to use it.
As you know... it restores the computer back to day one.
As you also know... it will take me three days to reload my security suite... all the security and windows updates (which have come out, since I bought my computer)... and of course, all my programs (which did not come stock with the computer).
I'll be downloading and uploading programs for a week.
But yeah... ultimatey, that's where this road is leading.
I should probably do it sooner than later, while the computer is still functioning at all.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

BTW Lauren... one other thing.

"Starship" (one of our staff) has read and reviewed almost every TLB-related book published.
He's very repsected within the blogger community, and could definitely steer you towards some good literature (both now, and in the future).
He's basically our "resident expert" on TLB books.

Unknown said...

Thanks so much guys!! I've always wanted to see the Hendrickson documentary! How much is it and where can it be ordered?

Also, Im not opposed to reading the Schrek book. As a college student, Im already used to reading things that make me go "What the hell..". But first I want to start iut with the basics.

All of my knowledge is based on internet research, so its time I hit the books!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


Allow me to break this topic down for you with specifics.

Buy "Helter Skelter" first.
It's a bit boring, but you'll learn a TON... and you'll refer to it often.
After reading it... you'll know what everyone (on the blogs) is talking about, at all times.
You'll be able to understand and participate in all blog conversations.
If you had to read just one book... read HS.
As I said... it will prepare you for blog discussion, better than all others.
Even the folks who hate the "Helter Skelter" book (and it's author), refer to it constantly

Get Ed Sanders' book, "The Family".
You'll get a humorous look at all the players.

Get something related to your favorite "Player"... whether that be "Squeaky" (like me)... or, one of the others.
There's a book written by (or about) almost every one of the "family" members.

Fourth and Laslty...
Read something that presents "alternative motive theories".
Explore a book which presents "outside the box" thinking (in regards to motive).
There's a few out there... Schreck being just one of them.
Personally... I think most of these theories are bunk... but the value in these books, is that they get you "thinking" for yourself.

In my estimation... that would be the perfect TLB journey!
(And believe me... I've been doing this for a LONG time)

Peace and good luck to you, my young grasshopper! LOL!

: )

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Anonymous said...

Hendrickson's got the 2 films plus his new book on ebay for $100...

Unfortunately that's a bit pricey, as the second film is pants really.

And, though I haven't read the book, it sounds nutty from what he posted about it at Liz's.

Unknown said...

Thanks so much Lynyrd! Im deff asking for Helter Skelter and The Family, hey I need a few beach reads for when I go to Puerto Rico after Christmas!

When I reach the third stage, I'll deff get Paul Watkin's book. He talks about all of the girls and what not, which Im interested in. Then I'll get the Lulu book since shes one of my faves, and the squeaky book, I've really developed a liking towards her recently. Too bad Nancy or Gypsy doesn't have a book.

MrPoirot said...

Lauren Webster said...
My parents are well aware of my fascination for years haha. I have a funny story. In 5th grade which was when my fascination started after seeing the E! True Hollywood Story on Sharon Tate, I dressed up as a hippy for our elementary school parade. I put an X on my forehead and to my surprise my teacher who was only 40 knew and called my mom. Woops!
I always wanted to read Helter Skelter but Col Scott's hatred for the book always made me disinterested

Poirot relies:

Col Scott hates Bugliosi because Col Scott is a disbarred lawyer. He's jealous of Bug and every other atty on earth.

I can't believe you dressed up as a Manson girl. Geez! I'm surprised you didn't have a police raid on your parents house. Helicopters, M16s and all.
I'll bet you still hear about that from time to time.
You're not gonna go Biker Chick on us like Nancy Pitman are you? Wow that gal led a needlessly rough life. She was mean as a rattlesnake when she was 14. She's my fav foxy Manson girl but if I had dated her I'd be afraid she'd kill me and bury me in her basement so I decided to worship her from afar. I've always wondered what made her so mean so young.

Unknown said...

I've read Col Scott for years! He was the first Manson blog I knew of, but I never registered to comment because I always had a fear he was going to attack me. His rants about White Rabbit are hysterical though.

As for Nancy, I find her adorable! Deff one of my favorites, she was so bubbly! I feel like she be a GREAT person to hear from, as she was considered Manson's "Golden Girl" (he commented on a picture of her). How I would LOVE it if she wrote a book but I doubt that will ever happen.

Im even more surprised they didn't send me to a school shrink LOL!

Mrstormsurge said...

Lynyrd, don't know if this is at all relevant but I double backup everything on my computer. One is with a hard drive that I mirror the entire hard drive with and the other is in the cloud (not a mirror). The backup in the clouds is constantly updating when I'm online.

If the computer goes down I am back up in no time. I use Carbonite, by the way and I surf the net with Firefox. IE gave me too many viruses.

katie8753 said...

STORMY!!!! :)

Lauren, I think the best book to start with is Helter Skelter. It's a long book and it's chocked full of facts. You may have to refer to it again and again for references. The only problem with this book is that it goes by dates. But it has more factual info than you'll find probably anywhere.

The Family is a nice read too. Sanders makes it funny and "downhome", which makes it easier to understand. And he does explore the Manson "myths" which are not true, but gives a bit of a giggle here and there.

Other than that, if you read books written by the killers, you're just taking their word for it.

You mentioned hearing about the murders because of Sharon Tate. There's another good book called "Sharon Tate and the Manson Murders" by Greg King. It's more about Sharon than the murders, but I really liked it. I got it at the library.

MrPoirot said...

Katie I listened to the podcast update.

Shreack said you were at the murders.

Mrstormsurge said...

Katie and Lynyrd, always makes me feel great to be welcomed here. Thx!!

katie8753 said...

Mr. P, I heard that. HA HA HA.

Stormy you are SO welcome here! I love that cigarette smoking baby. And I love your comments!

Warm Hugs!! :)

Michelle78 said...

Lauren, my interest in TLB is fairly recent (at least compared to the others on the various blogs) and I would second the advice Lynyrd gave. I read HS first, and while some parts were dry, I got totally hooked into it. After finishing that, I read The Family, which definitely wasn't as dry and was probably easier to follow since I already had gotten the basics from reading HS. I then got the Long Prison Journey of LVH, since she was the player that had captured my interest the most.

To Lynyrd and all that run and contribute to this blog, I really enjoy it! As a relative newbie to TLB, I've found a lot of good info through this blog and enjoy the fact that for the most part there is discussion that doesn't devolve into personal attacks, etc.

Unknown said...

Same here Michelle, Leslie has always been one of my main favorites! I read a tidbit of it from an old website and it sounds like a great read!

Kimchi said...

Michael from Backporch Tapes will be on the Science Channel tonight at 10:00 p.m Pacific Time -

"Death Dealers" - he will be doing a guided tour around Spahn Ranch for the folks that own the Museum of Death in Hollywood...

Should be interesting...

Unknown said...

And I agree with Michelle again too, I love the warm atmosphere here!! I was always afraid to join the blogs because as a young person who is interested in the case, I always felt people would misjudge me or attack me. But now I regret waiting to join!

Michelle78 said...

Lauren, it is a pretty good read, although since the author is close to LVH it is in no way an objective look at her life and participation in the LaBianca murders. Since there are no other books that I'm aware of that focus on LVH, it is a good source of info on her. It's a quick read too, probably good for some beach reading.

MrPoirot said...

I had the impression that Stephanie Schram had a book already in the works but have heard nothing since Brian Davis interviewed her earlier this year. There have been several insiders who for some reason abandoned a book deal. Paul Watkins has been the only one who had the initiative and drive to sit down and write a book. I suspect most of the former members are brain dead which is how they ended up at the Ranch in the first place.

Unknown said...

Wasn't Gypsy supposed to be writing a book along time a go? Her book deal is as old as me!

MrPoirot said...

Perhaps another former member suggested that Gypsy keep her mouth shut. Perhaps she didn't want to reimplicate those who have normal lives now.

Kimchi said...

We are glad you came aboard Michelle and Lauren - yes, the water is warm here...LOL...

Lynyrd is a great person and runs a good blog...

Mr. P says:

"I had the impression that Stephanie Schram had a book already in the works but have heard nothing since Brian Davis interviewed her earlier this year."

I think it is still in the works, it takes a long time for publishers to edit and what not... something like 5 years or so is not uncommon...

"There have been several insiders who for some reason abandoned a book deal. Paul Watkins has been the only one who had the initiative and drive to sit down and write a book. I suspect most of the former members are brain dead which is how they ended up at the Ranch in the first place."

Mr. P, what about Leslie, Susan, Tex, Lynette, Paul, Oniya Sipes, only to mention a few?

By the way girls, you can read Tex's book on line for free at

Gypsie wrote a book but haven't heard any updates on it or when it will be published...

And what about the Nelson (ahem) books? Nobody mentioned

katie8753 said...

Thanks Kimchi!

Night y'all!

MrPoirot said...

Mr. P, what about Leslie, Susan, Tex, Lynette, Paul, Oniya Sipes, only to mention a few? (end quote)

Kimchi as far as former members go; Paul is all I know of. I've never heard of Sipes. Bravin wrote Lynette's book. Even if Lynette wrote one today, I'm not sure she's sane enough to say anything new.The former members seem to want nothing more than to forget those days.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Welcome to the blog Michelle!
Feel free to join any discussion... or start one of your own!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Stormsurge... You ROCK my brother!

I've got all my files backed-up three times.
No worries there.
I just gotta get my computer back in gear.
I'm currently using a 12 year old computer, that I dug out of the closet, which moves like a snail. LOL!

I've got a couple tricks left up my sleeve, before I do the complete "recovery disc" overhaul.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


If you can get me a link to Michael's tv show... I'll post it for everyone.

sunset77 said...

Lynyrd, I just remembered 1 other option you might try if you have it and are able.

There is a somewhat hidden program in Windows called "chkdsk" or (check disc). In 4 years I've ran it about 3 times, the last 2 times it didn't do anything, but the first time, it solved some of my computer problems.

I think it's in all versions of Windows but I'm not sure, plus it's been changed through Windows updates.

To get to it on my computer I have a desk top icon on my computer called "My Computer", I double click that, then I RIGHT click on "Local Disc (C:) Local Disc", then I click on properties, then click "Tools", at the top is "Error Checking", I'm pretty sure that is "chkdsk"

It's been changed since I first ran it, I think when you click "check now" you get a message to schedule when you want it to run. Any way, I just select "the next re-start" and then restart my computer and it automatically starts running. One time it took like 7 hours, page after page after page of black and white print kept flashing on my screen, but it did eventually solve one of my computer problems once.

Brian Davis said...

Cease2 wrote, And...if you're considering the Schreck, have a good think about whether you really want to pass your (or your parents) address along to him or whoever handles his shipping, and whoever they might pass their database of buyers details on to in the future.

Please don't mistake my tone here as I am not intending to come off with any "attitude" but sincerely, why would you say this ? Are you meaning Schreck or his handlers would pass the address on to some cult or satanic group ? Or to some other relious group ? Do you know this first hand ? Please cite if you do, I'd like to know. Because what I do know is that Schreck purposely did not go thru as mainstream publisher to avoid such corporate pig under the table misuse of peoples personal info. Such as Amazon or others might do.

It isnt Schreck you need to worry about, its the ones that sell what your recommending, HS and The Family, that will misuse your info.

But I also got the impression you were trying to tell her Schreck would be doing something untrustworthy because of his former ties to satanism.

Regardless, I can assure you ordering Schrecks book is much safer than ordering Helter Skelter.

With that being said, Schrecks book isnt TLB 101, and you are all right in recommending HS and The Family first, imo.

Lauren Webster wrote, "I always wanted to read Helter Skelter but Col Scott's hatred for the book always made me disinterested."

Lauren, I like what I am reading from you so far in terms of your comments. But please never let anyone's opinion on things disinterest you or I am afraid you are going to miss out on a lot of good things in life.

And especially in this weird TLB world. You MUST think for yourself.

Don't let anyone's opinion sway you. Just my 2cents. Thanks

Brian Davis said...

Also, that is an interesting angle about Spahn and his wife. As someone commented, how weird that Spahns wife had been living on the ranch the whole time. Yet, we never knew or heard about her. I cant believe Hendrickson didnt get her somewhere in his films. Just a glimpse or peek or something. This is the first I knew Spahn had a wife back then. Good stuff thanks !

revatron said...

I think Susan Atkins' book is underrated. I like it. In it she says that everyone who analyzes the murders overlooks the shooting of Crowe as the catalyst. I agree. She also tells a wild story about kidnapping her child back from a foster family.
I'd like to read Paul's book but it is overpriced. I understand it can be read in full over at that awful clipart abyss of a website.
For my money Helter Skelter is the best book on the subject. Some people discredit it because of the motive it presents, but motive aside, it's full of facts, dates, times - It's written by the lead prosecutor.
I thought The Family was laughable. Lots of tall tales.
I just read Desert Shadows, and despite not being written by a family member or lead prosecutor, I liked it.

MrPoirot said...

A park ranger wrote Desert Shadows. I liked it becaise it takes you up into the mtns of Death Valley. I got it by interlibrary loan

Ajerseydevil said...

L,S I hope you don't mind me mentioning
The other blog I belong to Eviilz MANSON Family blog since it appears none of us are
Pro MANSON I think everyone on here would
enjoy the latest post a letter written by my man St. Sircumstance to Gov. Jerry Brown
Asking that he veto any chance of Bruce Davis being granted parole

Anonymous said...

Pro TRUTH!!!!
Anti-assumption ;)

Davis has so many loose ends throughout his history. So many unexplained actions and occurences surround good ol' Bruce. He's a shady dude. On those points you keep him inside.
It costs A LOT to house old people. Prison is there for punishment and to protect society. My ten year old could now kick Bruce's ass. It's probably more humane to leave him in, so I say, let the guy out.
Give him his money earned, kick him in the ass and say good luck Bruce!!!
The prison system is going to be an old folks home in the next decade or so with 3 strikes laws and no parole holds. EXPENSIVE!!

Bruce is safer and will live longer in jail, so....I opinion.....let him out.

Hope all is well where all are well.


Anonymous said...

To keep Bruce in is to pay for Bruce to live. Is it better to let him out or keep him in????

You could probably give him one hearty shove and any threat would be solved.

It'll be interesting to see what they do with Mr. Davis. Decision time is coming soon.

Brian Davis said...

Josh Bratt, I love reading your comments ! Thanks !

katie8753 said...

Hi Brian!!! :)

Marliese said...

Hi Brian,

i'm excited that St. C is going to be your guest! He is my blog hero, and i miss him. Will be listening for sure...:)

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I gotta be honest folks... I'm a bit confused by recent developments.

Brian and Saint Circumstance are scheduled to discuss TLB on Brian's radio show this sunday evening.
Does Brian realize that Saint Circumstance is an administrator at

Brian's radio show schedule is none of my business.
It's just that, considering the relationship between Starcity Radio and Saint's appearance on the show, seems a bit unlikely to me (if not a bit weird).

I mean... considering the situation.... why would Brian want Saint on his show... and furthermore, why would Saint want to be there?
Will this be a TLB discussion or a brawl? LOL

Just wonderin...

As I said... none of my business...

I guess either way, it will be good listening. LOL

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Carry on folks! ... LOL

Unknown said...

I feel awkward lmao.. I go everywhere!

Brian Davis said...

Marliese said...
Hi Brian,

i'm excited that St. C is going to be your guest! He is my blog hero, and i miss him. Will be listening for sure...:)

November 30, 2012 2:51 PM

Hi Marliese ! it's good to see you again, it has been quite a while :)

And if all it took was getting the Saint to come on the program to get you to listen, I would've asked him on months ago ! LOL !

Marliese please email me I would like to ask you something private but not anything to do with the drama, etc but is TLB related.

If not, no worries, I still think highly of you. And thanks for listening on Sunday !

Brian Davis said...

HI KATIE !!!! Great to see you !! :)

Anonymous said...

We all go everywhere, we just don't talk about After a while you get a feel for people, where they stand and why. Some are more invested in their opinions than in getting anywhere constructive though. Careful.....this case will consume you!!

Thank you for your kind words Brian. I enjoy your posts as well as your interviews and insight. I'dh have to agree with certain assessments you make as well, outing seems to be snitch's business.....

Lynyrd, you got the best site going are IT
If I were you I wouldn't even say anything about 'em. You're above it. Above and Beyond my friend. You're query does seem valid though....


Brian Davis said...

Lynyrd, Hello Chief !

First, I appreciate you letting my comment thru in regards to William Marshall up top there.

I certainly wasn't intending to use the LSB3 as any type of battlefield as I know you will go out of your way to make sure this great blog stays great. So, I apologize to all for that.

I just felt compelled.

However it does segue' nicely into your observation of St. Circumstance being on the EL "staff".

Yes, I can undersatnd the confusion. LOL !

And you are correct, there is a tremendous amount of heat right now between Evil Lizard and TLB Radio. Moreso than usual due to Matt trying to be "clever" recently.

But, just to be clear, The Saint Circimstance will be coming on the

TLB Radio Program at
this Sunday 8pm ET,as an independent.

(thats how you do a cheap, shameless plug, William Marshall)

The Saint Circumstance is coming on the program representing only himself and his thoughts, opinions etc.

There will be no mention of Evil Lizard unless I can't control myself and start some rant. LMAO ! But I think Saint's rationale will keep me inline.

It's The Saint being The Saint and those who have read him hopefully will be as interested in hearing him.

Now the question is, when is LYNYRD coming on The Program ? hehehehe ?

Just for those that don't know, I have been trying to get the man on the program for weeks or even months now. I certainly respect his decision to decline but Lyn, my man, you would be gold !

Open invite for you Lyn always, friend ! Maybe the members here can prod you into it eventually, lol !

Btw, I am happy to see you up and running again with the PC !

Thanks for all LSB3 !

Brian Davis said...

Marliese, just in case you will:

Thank youuuuuuu ! :)

Brian Davis said...

Josh Bratt said...
Some are more invested in their opinions than in getting anywhere constructive though. Careful.....this case will consume you!!

COMMENT OF THE WEEK !! maybe of all researching time !

katie8753 said...

Brian, I'm looking forward to Sunday night's show. Should be very interesting.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Sunset said:
"Lynyrd, I just remembered 1 other option you might try if you have it and are able"... etc...

Hi Sunset (or anyone with computer suggestions, adice, or tips)

Here's where I'm at computer-wise:

I downloaded a couple anti-malware (anti-spyware) programs.
I ran the scans.
The software programs detected a bunch of crap on my computer, which I deleted.
That helped a LOT.

My computer now boots-up normally again, without crashing.
I don't have to use "safe mode" anymore to stay afloat.
I can navigate the whole computer again... and I can surf the web with Firefox.

The glitch... is that for some reason... my Internet Explorer browser, still won't load my home page... or any page, for that matter.
It just never opens.
I get that "waiting cursor"... formerly an hourglass (LOL)... but now, that blue circle.

At any rate... everything is functioning, except Internet Explorer.
It sucks... because I used IE a LOT.

I figured I would remove the current version of IE, and re-download the browser program fresh.
Trouble is... IE is not found in my programs, where the "program delete" feature is found.
Basically, every OTHER program is there, but IE.

Any ideas?

sunset77 said...

I can't help you much with IE Lynyrd. I ran IE 7 up until about 1 year ago, I switched to Firefox. I got a notice from YouTube about 1 month ago that they won't support IE 7 anymore, so I downloaded IE 8. It works, but not very well. Every time I open it, I get a message saying something is trying to change my homepage. If I monkey with it, I can eventually get it to work.

I think I read somewhere once that you can't remove IE from Windows, you can only update it, that might be why you can't find it in "all programs".

You might be able to find some help in YouTube vids, search "problems with IE", often I've found help there. You might also try the microsoft webpage and try to update your version of IE.

I HIGHLY recommend Firefox. I run "no-script" and "ad-block" add ons, they work great and fast for me and I don't get these various "trojans" and other crap on my computer anymore.

I have "Malwarebytes" and "Spybot Search and Destroy", I seldom have to run them since I changed to Firefox. Since I switched to Firefox, when I run Malwarebytes, it always says, "no problems found" or something.

To be honest, almost no one uses IE anymore, from what I've read, Firefox, Opera, Chrome, Safari, etc. are all better.

Anonymous said...

Hi Lynyrd. I use Chrome, and before that Firefox. And have had no problems, and they load up quicker than IE I believe.

Good thing is that when you install a new browser, it prompts you to import all your 'Favorites' over from your old browser.

I can't see what functionality IE has that the others don't. Maybe it's more a familiarity thing for you?

Mama Sunshine said...

I would never ever recommend Helter Skelter by the bug... More fiction than fact