In advance of the 12 March 2014 parole hearing for Bruce Davis, some reading homework for those interested in how the system functions:
A report from 2011 by Stanford Law School with regards to "An Examination of Parole Release for Prisoners Serving Life Sentences with the Possibility of Parole in California":
The rules that the California Board of Prison Terms work to:
The handbook published by Victim Services in California for those attending parole hearings:
Because of the ghost of Doris Tate; Bruce has a zero % chance of ever leaving prison. Too much pressure is brought upon the governor for him to over allow parole for any Family member convicted of murder. Charlie and Family may have beat the rap according to Bug but they didn't beat Doris Tate. Some people get real mad after you kill their daughter.
Has anybody heard of this new threat from hash oil production? Why wasn't this going on back at Spahn Ranch in 68? Is there something new involved here that didn't exist back then?
Hey Lynyrd, Christopher give us to much homework.
Is that a picture of Bruce?
That's a good question Katie, apparently, it is. Look-->HERE
Sunset that is a very good article on Bruce you linked us to. I never knew much about him at all. The article even refutes all the tales about Bruce hiding out under a overpass in a pie. Turns out he was back home in Tenn. You wouldn't think a guy with an X carved on his forehead could get very far without getting caught yet he criss-crossed the country with no problem.
Just last night I ran across an article where Gypsy said most of the Manson girls were anorexic or bulemic or both. I never knew that. Now I know why Brenda was always so skinny.
There is still a lot to learn about the characters in this massive saga.
Thanks Sunset. What is social science?
Mr. P, you oughta write a thread on the fact that they were anorexic or bulimic. That's interesting.
truthfully Katie, I think it would be surprising if the girls didn't have eating disorders. These were NOT all-American girls (before CM) as the media likes to portray them.
Stapling up the arm, doing porn, topless and promiscuous, having an idiot father like Ruth Ann did...most of the girls all had major issues.
That's an interesting question - who was the most "normal" girl to join the Family? Maybe Stephanie? Maybe Kitty? What do you think.
The Ghost of Doris Tate - that is an interesting and real concept, Mr P.
God bless her.
I don't know Leary, that's a hard question. Which is these girls would have stayed "normal" if they hadn't met Manson?
I know this probably isn't anyone's obvious choice, but I'd have to say Pat Krenwinkel. Basically, she just had some major self esteem issues BC (before Charlie), which a lot of young girls have and those issues can be dealt with and outgrown. I think that if she'd never met Charlie & the gang, she'd probably be enjoying her great grandkids by now.
Katie? Nah. I forget who said this so forgive me for not sacknowledging but I read a quote once where someone was talking about a family pic of the Krenwinkles where they noticed this cute little girl standing there with a look on her face that said "my needs aren't being met".
I myself was stunned to see Krenwinkle's ma and pa at Pat's trial where the ma wore a mink coat. Obviously these parents were more into how they looked than they were in sincerity. Though they were there together at the trial they never dared say they had been divorced for years and the other daughter was a deceased heroin addict.
Rock star days of Ed Sanders aand the Fugs
Was Stephanie normal? Get real! She was with a guy in a gas station at 2 a.m. and ditches him and goes off with Charlie whom she had never seen before. And people wonder why so many dead women are found at the bottom of a ravine off Mulholland Dr.
There wasn't anybody who ended up with Charlie at Spahn Ranch who was normal.
If I had to nominate someone at Spahn's as being the most normal I'd pick the old lady who lived in the dog house: Dodie. The rest of the people there came from familial bomb craters.
But as far as the men at Spahn's: would anybody say Tex, Clem and Paul came from functioning family backgrounds until they partook of drugs?
Mr. P said: I read a quote once where someone was talking about a family pic of the Krenwinkles where they noticed this cute little girl standing there with a look on her face that said "my needs aren't being met".
What little girl doesn't look like that? LOL.
Katie I always subscribe to the theory that a pic is worth a thousand words. In family fotos some families hold hands or hug maybe even kiss. In other fotos it looks like the photographer had to use a wide angle lens in order to get them all in the frame because they feel so uncomfortable getting too close to each other. It's pretty easy to spot a family where there is no love. Sometimes you see everyone with their arms crossed and not touching anyone else.
I remember one time I tried to foto my family at a wedding. My sister was hissing at me like a snake.
Mr. P said: would anybody say Tex, Clem and Paul came from functioning family backgrounds until they partook of drugs?
I wouldn't say Clem did. Wasn't he in the nuthouse before he met Charlie?
man, you nailed me on that one MrP. I had completely forgotten that scenario of CM and Stephanie meeting. I was projecting backwards as in her interview with Brian Davis she seemed so solid. Also she actually had the chutzpah to tell Manson she would only be with him if he was monogamous.
I can see where you are coming from selecting Katie, Katie. She is probably the most normal now. But I agree with MrP again that she was seriously twisted when she came to the Family. I would like to know more about Ella Jo Bailey. She was one of the early ones signing up and stayed right up to Gary's demise. She had the common sense to get the hell out of there when Manson's dark side became a fact.
Yea we gotta scratch Clem off the list too.
Maybe a chick like Bo Rosenberg who was one of the hippies living at the back ranch that was invited to LSD trips by Charlie which she then started participating in the orgies. She had the dumb luck to have been at Spahns before Charlie got there. Paul Watkins said she was always resisting Charlie's ego death crapola by saying things like, no I won't do it Charlie. He could never quite get her to completely die thus she ended up at Barkers with Paul Watkins who asked to be released from all agreements with Charlie. Of course Bo had Paul ask Charlie to release her while Watkins went back to see Charlie in LA while she remained at Barkers. Juanita did that too. Bo and Juanita had to be two of the all time greatest party chicks. They were always willing to chip in at a an orgie if it was a girl or two short.
yeah, I would love to know if Ella Jo was an orgy girl. She would have to have been, right. But I've always wondered if any of the girls said no to Manson's insistence on everyone doing the same sex act. I suspect a couple of the guys balked at that one too. I don't see Donkey Dan doin one of his own, not that there's, you know.
Funny, in reading HS again it was clear that for awhile Vince considered Sandy the most reachable and potential escapee from the Family. I consider Sandy and Nancy as the two most psycho of the girls. By that I mean if I was there in '69 those two would have been the ones I would have crossed the street to avoid.
I thought Bo Rosenberg joined the Family because she was married to TJ? Or did they marry after the Family broke-up?
Dunno Bo's whole story but she lived up where John Friedman the artist lived on the back ranch. She was one of the hippies who occupied the old ranch house that Manson was eyeing for his people. Charlie would invite her up to the boardwalk.
Though she ended up in the Family she got free of them while at Barkers when Charlie was still at Spahns.
She was foto'd at the trials so she obviously came back into the Family. Perhaps this period is where she met and married TJ.
I checked out your link to the hash production Mr. P. First I heard that there is a risk involved. Maybe it just has to do with the way they are trying to make it. I grew up on the Canadian east coast, and that stuff used to come in from areas like Turkey/Lebanon/Afghanistan by the massive tonnage, like 10 - 15 ton loads, so I have trouble seeing there was a risk with production. I think I would have heard about that.
Hash and hash oil are different. A tiny drop of oil on the head of a pin will buzz you off the planet when inhaled as smoke. Hash comes in blocks. Has is more potent than marijuana but less potent than oil.
I'm pretty sure that TJ Walleman (Tom) married Lori Walleman (Ansom 13) at some point, they had 3 kids. TJ's brother John was apparently married to a woman named "Cyn". She posted a comment on another blog in 2009, it can be seen -->HERE.
I'm pretty sure I received an e-mail from "Cyn" about 3 years ago. She asked me not to re-post it so I never have. I've since lost that e-mail in a "computer crash".
I noticed a comment about hash oil. My senior year in college 7 of us rented a house, one of our buddies owned a "head shop". He sold hooka pipes, water bongs, power hitters, hash oil pipes, etc. so we always had a good supply of that stuff at discount prices. A hash oil pipe was just a clear glass tube with one end molded in the shape of a pipe bowl. You would put a small glob of hash oil in the pipe end and hold it over the kitchen stove till the tube filled up with smoke, then hit it.
One time we had some type of drug called "green". It looked similar to marijuana, but it was almost a fluorescent green color. It was super powerful. We had to leave one day and there were 2 Nigerians there that said they had to leave also, we gave them a bit of green. We came back about 4 hours later and the Nigerians were laying in the middle of the living room floor, we asked them "what happened?", they said "no can drive".
I'm pretty sure that TJ Walleman (Tom) married Lori Walleman (Ansom 13) at some point, they had 3 kids
Beauders was saying Bo married TJ. If so then it was in the 70s before TJ married Ansom13.
Perhaps she was never married to TJ. Let's clear this up quick.
Mr P said:
Bo and Juanita had to be two of the all time greatest party chicks. They were always willing to chip in at a an orgie if it was a girl or two short.
I don't know Mr P, according to Family legend, Bo was a biter.
Bo seems to be one of the more elusive girls. Apparently Bugliosi thought she and Barbara Hoyt were the same person. If you look up 'Bo Rosenberg' in the index of Helter Skelter it says "see Barbara Hoyt".
Michaels Backporch site has some pictures of TJ and a very pregnant Bo.
Scroll down about three quarters and look for the title:
The girl Manson called Rainbow (mother of the birth of the colors) Barbara Rosenberg
Barbara Rosenberg was TJ's first wife, they eventually divorced. He then met Ansom 13 and married her. Manson introduced TJ and Ansom as Anson was someone who was writing to and visiting Manson.
Why was she named Ansom 13? Were there 12 Ansom's preceding her???
This link is to a interesting article Lynyrd posted here a while back. Bo is mentioned. Part of the article concerns a period when Bo was at Barkers while the Family was at Spahns. There obviously were people at Barkers besides Paul Watkins, Brooks, Crockett and Juanita.
13 for Charlie's cell number at San Quentin?
Poirot, Hash oil was one of the Brotherhood of Eternal Love's main imports from Afghanistan beginning around 1972
Manson gave her the name Ansom. Thirteen was Manson's cell number at the time.
In the link above about Jenny that includes a mention of Bo it describes how Jenny escapes in secret by pretending to go hiking with one of the children. Even leaving behind a prized Martin guitar in order not to reveal her intent to escape.
Obviously Jenny felt Bo was one of THEM yet in Paul Watkin's book he says Bo wanted out. Which was it? Did Bo want in or out? Maybe it was both. It just depends on what day it was. Or perhaps Bo hid her desire to escape just as Jenny did.
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