Tuesday, May 21, 2013

Rare Charles Manson Photos

Charles Manson with his wife (Wedding Day)
Related Excerpts from Ed Sanders' Book:

Michael (from Backporch Tapes) asks Manson about this wedding photo. 
Phone conversation - 5/22/2013

Charlie jokes:
"Yeah, I married Bruce Willis... I mean, Rosalie Willis". LOL
Manson goes on to describe her as "a chubby Irish gal". LOL

Little Charles Manson with his cousin (and possibly grandmother).
Was this photo taken the same day?  YOU DECIDE!  LOLOL!!

From "Rolling Stone" Magazine



LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I must say...

Manson was looking pretty dapper on his wedding day... and his wife isn't half bad either.

She's a decent looking woman.

katie8753 said...

Well, three-hole gave her speech to the jury that she wants to live.

Hmmmm....she's been saying since 2008 that she wants to die. In fact, she said it 6 days ago in a local TV interview after the was convicted. But suddenly, she says she has "prospective". LOL.

But I digress....

She claims that she can be productive in prison for the following reasons:

She can teach Spanish to the inmates.

99% of them probably already speak Spanish.

She can teach them sign language.

Well....that could come in handy some day I guess.

She can teach them to read.

She's assuming that she's the only one in the general population that knows how to read.

She can sell T-Shirts for abuse survivors.

And keep the profits for herself.

She can recycle.

Okay....this is dumb. She's in prison.

She's artistic.

She traces pictures.

She actually trashed Travis again in her plea for "mercy", although she didn't use the word "mercy" and didn't tell Travis' family she was sorry that she ripped him to pieces and left him like a pile of garbage in the shower.

And most of all....she didn't tell the truth about WHY she killed him.

She has made arrangements to have interviews tonight with several stations. She's a pathetic pig, oinking to the trough.

The only remedy is death by lethal injection.

katie8753 said...

3-Hole asked the jury to give her life in prison "for her family's sake" because they can't live without her.

Camera pans in on the "family" and you see the Mom & Dad looking glassy-eyed like they were watching 4 hours of home movies of George Costanza's family visits to the Poconos. And the "stupid sister" has her cheek on her palm looking like she's catching 40 winks. The brother looks like he's in a Twilight Zone episode and I'm pretty sure I saw him eating buggers.

Then 3-Hole's attorney, Will-Can't, zones in on her family too. She explains to the jury that her parents were pieces of shit that ignored her, that constantly beat her, and didn't let her have her way all the time.

(See footnote above for reaction).

Whoa Nelly! Let's get our stories straight.

Also, 3-Hole states that she grows her hair out and cuts it off for Love-Loks.

That takes a lot of effort to grow hair. LOL.

katie8753 said...

Wow Charlie was cute in that wedding picture. All decked out.

Look out for that knife. LOL.

Unknown said...

Please, anyone of you got the other susan's book? Child Of God, Child of Satan?

I am looking for every ebook (FREE!!!) that i could find, because i want to read a lot about her and the manson familly.

Thanks in advance,

Best regards, from Portugal.

Zarathustra said...

Thank you so much for those great photos, first time I ever see the first three ones!

Zarathustra said...

Moita sorte com esse libro Joao, e benvido!

Unknown said...

Zara :) Obrigado!! Eu procuro os livros em PDF . Onde posso encontrar e fazer download?

Unknown said...

Zara :) Obrigado!! Eu procuro os livros em PDF . Onde posso encontrar e fazer download?

sunset77 said...

Apparently, the FBI shot and killed a friend of one of the Boston Marathon bombers this morning.

A small story about it can be seen HERE.

I searched a website called "Veenegle", it has a list of YouTube videos possibly connected to "Ibragim Todashev", the man apparently killed.

There is a possibility that Ibragim Todashev uploaded an EXTREMELY GRAPHIC video to YouTube on April 6, 2013. The Marathon bombings occurred on April 15.

The video is of a person cutting off the head of what appears to be a baby lamb, it is EXTREMELY GRAPHIC, it can be seen HERE.

The vid will almost certainly be removed from YouTube shortly, if you want to see it, you'd better watch it quick.

This is a "just breaking" news story, some of my facts may not be correct.

Anonymous said...

The fastest way to put Jodi to death would be to have Dr Drew treat her.....Just ask former patients Mindy McCready, Rodney King, Mike Starr and Jeff Conway. Oh wait, you can't ask them because they're DEAD!

Go easy on Kirk Nurmi (Baby Huey), though. I think he is probably a pretty good lawyer that got stuck in a terrible situation. Being a public defender, I don't know if he can pick and choose his clients like a private practice lawyer can. And he got stuck with a doozy when he was assigned Arias. I think if Nurmi told the truth in his closing he would have said that he didn't like Arias 10 out of 10 days. If any of the principals writes a book about this case, I think Nurmi would have the best story....."Defending Jodi".

katie8753 said...

Hi Jeffrey! I know that Nurmi got saddled with this case and he has tried various times to get off this case, to no avail.

As far as not liking this albatross, I have a feeling that his feelings toward her are nearing a "hate" pitch. She rushes to give interviews as often as she can, against his advice, which is killing his case. It's like the lunatic is running the asylum.

As far as how to kill 3-Hole, I think they should bring back the guillotine...just this once. :)

Doc Sierra said...

Charlie looks kind of like a young Conway Twitty in his wedding photo.

katie8753 said...

Hi Joao.

Please, anyone of you got the other susan's book? Child Of God, Child of Satan?

I am looking for every ebook (FREE!!!) that i could find, because i want to read a lot about her and the manson familly.

Sorry, I'm not sure about Susan's book. I haven't read it. As far as free downloads they might be available. I guess do an internet search. You might check Amazon for used copies. My guess is you'll have to pay at least something, unless you can Google search for something free.

I believe that Susan has/had a website, which was run by her now widower.

Sunset is one of the best sources on this kinda stuff. Sunset???

katie8753 said...

BOBBY!!! :)

Yes I agree, what changed Charlie from a happily wedded husband to a brutal hippy cult leader?

katie8753 said...


Conway Twitty and his Twitty Birds! LOL.

katie8753 said...

Okay, juristas, I'm going to pose a question to you.

It's been suggested by another blogger on another blog that Charlie was married twice. I've not heard of this. I know he married Rosalie, but this is the only wife I know of.

Does anyone else know of a second wife? Let's weigh in.....

Doc Sierra said...

Hi Katie,
Am I correct in assuming that the woman in the wedding photo is Rosalie?

katie8753 said...

Yes Doc, I'm assuming that photo is Rosalie.

katie8753 said...

I have more to reveal in this case tomorrow. Stuff that was revealed today.


Til tomorrow.....Same Bat Time...Same Bat Channel... LOL.

katie8753 said...

Wow I'm amazed that people don't know if Charlie had two wives.


Well til tomorrow....Lots more to reveal....

katie8753 said...

G'night Jugdish. :)

Doc Sierra said...

G'night John Boy......

Anonymous said...

Katie, are you counting the wife he married with the hose clamp ring?

katie8753 said...

Jeffrey, I forgot about her. HA HA.

Venus said...

He kind of has a teen idol look about him in the wedding pic, compare him to a young Frankie Avalon or Paul Anka.

He looks like the kind of guy you'd be proud to bring home to meet your parents.

Did Rosalie ever talk about him?

sunset77 said...

Apparently, there was a hung jury in the penalty phase of the Jodi Arias trial. They will have to get another jury together if they want to sentence her to death, if I understand it correctly.

Also, great pix Lynyrd, I hadn't seen a couple of them.

How many wives Manson had depends on your definition of "wife". Google lists 2, "Candy Stevens" is a name used by an alleged prostitute also using the name "Leona". It says they were married from 1959-1963. It lists Rosalie Jean Willis as being Manson's wife from 1955–1958.

katie8753 said...

Venus, it's so weird seeing Charlie being "normal", cutting a wedding cake. LOL.

Sunset, thanks. This Leona is purported by another blogger to be Charlie's second wife. I can't find any evidence of that. Sanders doesn't mention it, but he does mention prostitutes that Charlie was pimping out. I'll check that out further.

katie8753 said...

As to the 3-Hole Wonder's trial, the jury did wuss out and come back "hung".

I don't understand why, when they admitted in Voir Dire that they could impose the death penalty, found her guilty of pre-meditated first degree murder, found that she killed in a cruel and heinous manner, then suddenly grow some kind of "conscious" and decide they can't give her the death penalty.

As devastating as this is to Travis' family, who have basically put their lives on hold for almost 5 years, and will have to continue to do so, it's basically a feather in Juan Martinez' cap, because he can NOW use all those stupid interviews that 3-Hole gave every night against her.

As to 3-Hole's defense attorneys, I'm sure they will be hopping mad if they still can't get off. Oh well.....

katie8753 said...

Well 3-Hole is back in her familiar cell at Maricopa County, Arizona. Her tough-stuff Sheriff Joe, who was letting her have interviews 24/7 prior to this, has suddenly decided that she can't do that anymore. I guess someone chided him.

In those interviews, she was blaming everyone for her problems, including all of us. Yes! If you don't even know 3-Hole, you are at fault for her problems, whether you know it or not. LOL.

Well now she's back to 23 hours a day in a small hole, without a TV or anything but a tablet, a pencil and some books.

I hope that maybe somehow, she can finally realize what she did, stop lying to herself and finally have some remorse. Only then will she will finally face her judgement. Because she will face judgement some day, whether she believes it or not.

As I've said before. She's the perfect fit for the Manson killers. She's just like them all.....

Doc Sierra said...

I'm no Psych guy but from my college psych class I see a severe case of borderline personality disorder. This bitch is sick........

katie8753 said...

Yes Doc, she is sick. I think she's a sociopath. She doesn't have any feeling for other people's pain, including her victim, Travis Alexander.

What we have to remember is that she waited and talked him into a crouch, wherein she launched her attack. This was premeditated. She bided her time to attack him, knowing that when she struck, he would not be able to defend himself.

And her sawing his neck off was her coups de grĂ¢ce.

Oh well, I've got a lot of work to do for the next couple of days. I will research the "2nd Charlie wife "Leona". Give me a few days.

G'night Jugdish! G'night John Boy!! :)

Doc Sierra said...

Thanks Katie, G'night John Boy.....

sunset77 said...

According to a news story, the "Watson tapes" have been in possession of the police for a couple of weeks.

The Huffington Post story can be read HERE.

There doesn't seem to be any mention of any evidence of further murders or crimes of any type.

This should serve as a warning to anyone considering talking about crimes, even to a lawyer. Long established legal rights, like "lawyer client privilege" will be ignored by courts when they think it suits their purpose.

adam said...

Does anybody else feel a sadness whenever they see a picture of the infant Charlie? A stark reminder that he wasn't born evil, he was once a little boy who needed love and guidence just like the rest of us.

And the wedding photo, if a wife and baby aren't a reason to get your act together, what is?

maudes harold said...


Tex gave up attorney-client privilege when he let Chaplain Ray Huckster listen to those tapes for his book "Will You Lie for Me." No laws have been broken, except for the slaughter of a few people.....

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hi Adam.
I agree.

Bob, conveyed a similar sentiment earlier:
"Yes, Wow understated. They both look great. WTF happened ? JUst kidding about what happened. I have read a bit about it. Still really they look great. I sure wish things had worked out different".


This entire saga is a sad story, all the way around.
There are no winners here.
The victims, their families and friends... even the perpetrators themselves, have suffered... and EVERYONE concerned, would have been much better-off, if things had gone differently.

I agree... Manson looks very "normal" and happy in those photos (childhood and wedding).

Those photos give me pause, to think:
Is it really possible, for some folks to be born evil?
To look at those photos... you wouldn't think so.

It's probably more accurate to say, that some folks become disadvantaged mentally, socially, and emotionally... which in-turn, predisposes them to evil acts.

Manson (if I remember correctly) was arrested for some stupid crime (I believe auto theft) a year or so, after his wedding... and was sent to prison.
His wife lived with his mother during his incarceration (again, if I remember correctly) and remained faithful (to Manson) for about a year... after which time, she ran off with another man.

Her departure probably took another chunk out of Charlie... both mentally and emotionally.
I wouldn't doubt it.

One has to wonder what would have happened (to Manson), if she had remained faithful to him until his release.
I guess we'll never know...

It would be very interesting to know what has become of her (is she still alive?)... and more specifically... what was she thinking, when she (first) heard about the murders, arrests and convictions?
After all... that was her ex-husband.
Was she shocked? etc...

If anyone has any interesting facts or information about her... please enter it here (in the comments section), or email it to me privately.

St. Circumstance said...

I had never seen pics 1 and 2

in pic one they looks so very ordinary and promising

in pic two all three have a similar disturbing type of sinister look in the smile....

in my opinion ;)

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Seriously Saint?
Sinister? LOL

It's an old lady, with two children for cripes sakes. LOL

I think you're letting your knowledge of "future happenings" effect your perception.

I thought I was posting a wholesome photo.

Guess not... LOL

beauders said...

manson's mother said it was the loss of Rosalie, his first wife, that turned manson into the man we know. he truly loved her and was never the same after her loss. as far as I know Rosalie passed away a few years ago.

CarolMR said...

Manson looks like a cute little boy in the second photo.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Thanks Beauders.

That's pretty much the story, as I remember it too... (but, I didn't want to state it point-blank, as I wasn't 100% certain).

Maybe things would have been turned-out differently, if Rosalie stayed on?
Eh, who knows...

I have to admit... it's gotta kinda suck, having your newlywed wife bail on you (for another man), while you're in prison.
And heck... she didn't hang in there for very long either.
I mean... let's face it... if she bailed on Manson for another man within a year (or so)... she was probably diddling with "the other man", for six months prior.
These things don't happen overnight.
Did Rosalie start looking for another guy immediately? LOL
I'm sure Manson did the "timeline math" in his head too.

Does anyone know the timeline exactly?
I'm pretty sure the situation is outlined in the beginning of Sander's book, but I'm simply too darn lazy to look it up.
I wanna say, Rosalie lived with Manson's mom for about a year tops...

St. Circumstance said...

I dont know...

those eyes all look a little menacing to me....

I didn't see the same thing in the first pic and it is the same person

Maybe sinister was a bit strong- but they have a look to them which is just somehow off to me....

Poor chuckie- he wife left him- mommie didn't love him- he growed up in and out of reform schools...

lol excuses excuses excuses

they are like fake boobs and BMW's in Boca - everyone has them

except me :)

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hi Saint.

In the first photo, Manson and Rosalie are looking straight at the photographer.
(straight into the camera, as it were).
I assume the wedding photo was taken by a professional photographer.

In the second photo, all three of them are focused on something off to the right (their left)... and slightly above their level.
(Of course, they're sitting on the ground, so just about anything, would be above their level).

My guess:
There was probably a second amateur photographer (relative or friend) at this picnic/gathering taking pictures (simultaneously)... and the three of them, were focusing on the other camera.

It's happens...

It was probably one of those rare instances, when two people are taking photographs simultaneously at a family outing.

I really believe there had to be a second photographer to their left.
I mean... let's face it... people don't generally pose for a photo, and focus their eyes (in unison), to the side.
(Especially for a close-up).
The photographer of that photo, was obviously pretty close to them.

At any rate... having said all that... I agree, Saint... the perspective (and their focus) does make the three of them look a bit unusual, in that photo.
They look a bit freaky.
I really believe it's one of those situations, where things look a little weird, for completely innocuous reasons.

I bet if we saw more photos (of these three) from the same day/picnic (or, whatever it was) they'd all look fine.

Anyway, that's my two cents.

If you keep it up, I'll repost that Atkins tribute thread, with the Christopher Cross song.


I'm just bustin' ya...

Sailing... takes me away, to where I'm going...

Oh c'mon... you laughed a little bit.

St. Circumstance said...

I laughed alot... :)

good point- they may be all focusing on the same thing and that would be why they have similar " Shifty" look in your eyes. I couldn't quit put my finger on what bothered me- but you just figured it out for me- none of them are looking directly at you when they smile...

maybe you just explained why.

Hey they are both new to me and fascinating pictures. Thanks!

But I just see a bit of the young
Damien from The Omen in his smiling little face in that second pic as well- what can I say lol

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


It's actually the grandmother, that freaks me out.
I'd think twice, about jumping into her lap!

"I've got candy..." LOL

I'd definitely have to see more photos, before I'd allow my parents to leave me with her! LOL
She's like that psycho Bates woman, in the Stephen King movie. LOL

Manson actually looks the most normal.
The grandmother is just plain freaky... and the girl, is a close runner-up... (like Wednesday Addams).
Manson just looks like he's getting a kick out of it. LOL
Fuckin' whacko... LOL

For the record...
I've always kinda hated that Christopher Cross song.

It's a combination of severely depressing, and borderline sappy.
But, mostly just depressing...

I have to admit... I've never actually listened to all the words.
The melancholy tone of the music always destroys my mood, to the point where, I can't stay with the lyrics.

Some sad songs have a tone of hope, just under the surface.
Not "Sailing".
That song hammers-away mercilessly with melancholy drone, from beginning to end (at least in regards to tone).
Maybe it's just me...

Bottom line:
I wouldn't recommend playing "Sailing" in a loop, to anyone who is contemplating suicide. LOL!

At my funeral, I'd prefer something a bit more hopeful-sounding.
Ya know... with a message that maybe... just maybe... Lynyrd might actually "arise" once again! LOL!

Cross' album should have a disclaimer:
"Sailing"... pushing depressed people over the edge, for 3 decades. LOL

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


I uploaded a new photo.
Check it out!

katie8753 said...


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I feel kinda bad now.

They were probably very nice people.
The little girl is very well-dressed.
That's a very classy outfit... with the matching white shoes and everything...

Girls didn't dress that classy, when I was a kid.

It's just a lighthearted joke folks.

No need for anyone to freak-out.

St. Circumstance said...

Thats too funny!!!

Ya know- literally MTV was the end of Christopher Cross' career as a front man...

they literally told him he as not attractive enough for video- not making this up...

Check this out:

Since the 30th anniversary of MTV is upon us, the question of "What was the first video played on MTV" now loses its cachet (sp?) as a bar trivia question, with the answer being, of course, The Buggles Video Killed The Radio Star.

And, of course, the song is now taken as gospel, that video really did kill the radio star... but I don't know if I've ever seen anything about which radio stars were killed by video. Hence the discussion.

I'm sure there are a few, but IMHO, the #1 example of this, with a bullet, is poor old San Antonio native Christopher Cross (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christopher_Cross).

This guy was huge. I mean, he was a freakin' monster. His debut album was (at the time) the biggest selling album of 1979*, had 4 top-20 hits (with Sailing going to #1 and Ride Like the Wind going to #2), and because of it, Christopher Cross is the only solo artist to have won the top-4 Grammy awards in the same year: Song, Record, Album, and New Artist (and for good measure, he also won Best Arrangement, for Sailing).

And because the guy just couldn't get enough, he goes out in 1981 and grabs himself not just an Oscar but also a Golden Globe for his song The Best That You Can Do, from the movie Arthur (co-written with Burt Bacharach, but Cross sang as well as co-wrote). This song, too, went to #1.

So in two years, the guy goes from being a nobody to having 2 #1's, 3 more top-20's, 5 Grammy's, 1 Oscar, 1 Golden Globe, and the best-selling album of 1979.

In 1983, he releases his second album, Another Page, which is nowhere as well received as the first. There's only one top-10 song on here, Think of Laura, which made it to #9 largely on the basis of its General Hospital connection.

That was it. 99% of people never heard from the man again. Why?

Because he looked like this (http://4rightchords.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/christopher-cross.jpg). And this (http://cache4.asset-cache.net/xc/80686151.jpg?v=1&c=IWSAsset&k=2&d=77BFBA49EF8789215ABF3343C02EA54831727D479A1EF3EB64D1A1072747489B71326BE8B914BAF9E30A760B0D811297). And this (http://o.aolcdn.com/dims-photohub/dims3/NEWS/thumbnail/129x129/70/http://www.blogcdn.com/www.spinner.com/media/2008/02/christopher-cross-200-022108.jpg).

And while Mr. Cross isn't an ugly man, he is rather goofy looking in that Jason Alexander kind of way. And "goofy everyman" wasn't a look the new MTV was after.

I'm sure he fuckin' hates MTV. I would if I were him. I also would've cut down on the Twinkies and not worn so much pink, but that's just me... and it wasn't like androgyny wasn't a thing in the '80s, just not overweight adrogyny. That had to wait for the internet. ;)

Who else lost their way in the transition?

(I have another in mind, but want to see if others mention this act...)

*The Wall by Pink Floyd has since outsold it.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


That's the funniest post I've read in while.

Some of the "Highlight" phrases:

#1) "MTV was the end of Christopher Cross' career as a front man... they literally told him he as not attractive enough for video"


#2) "And while Mr. Cross isn't an ugly man, he is rather goofy looking in that Jason Alexander kind of way. And "goofy everyman" wasn't a look the new MTV was after..."


#3) "and it wasn't like androgyny wasn't a thing in the '80s, just not overweight adrogyny. That had to wait for the internet. ;)"

So true! LOL

In MTV's defense... I'd much rather look at "Martha Quinn" than a fat dude wearing pink pants and loafers!

I f#cking LOVED Martha!

I think MTV made the right decision.
: )

...and Here's Proof:

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

JimNY likes Christopher Cross.
What more do you need to know?


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Christopher Cross kinda reminds me of that fat dude that used to sing "Danke Schoen."

Fig Newton... I mean... Wayne Newton.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...


St. Circumstance said...

I just watched a Howard Stern episode with a reunion of the surviving original DJ's- they are out promoting a book they all did together- Martha still looks the same...

I think almost all guys had a crush on her when we were at that age lol She was once voted best VJ ever...

I can tell you she was and still is my exact type, and maybe she is partly why that is my exact type

Hey we are off to a wedding tonight. I was not psyched as I don't know the person getting married ( wife's high school friend) nor a single person who will be there. All my friends are down in Key West where the Heavy Pets are playing this weekend at the Green Parrot. But today I got the good news ( Or maybe today was the first time I paid attention) that the weeding is on a boat and we will be on a private cruise- with an open bar all nite...


so now I am a little more enthusiastic...

Everyone have a great Holiday weekend!!


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

The Saint.
Always vacationing...


"Endless Summer" HAS to be his favorite album. LOL

katie8753 said...

St, have fun. And don't get too close the railing. LOL.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Don't worry Katie.

I've seen photos of SaintC drinking alcohol on at least 12 different cruise ships by now.
He's a professional. LOL!

Only amateurs drown. : )

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

If there's anyone who knows their way around a ship deck with a cocktail glass... it's SaintC! LMAO!

He's got those slip-resistant moccasins, for just such occasions. LOL!

OK... I'll stop now.

katie8753 said...

Lynyrd LOL. He probably has a permanently-embedded life preserver under his Speedo. HA HA.

katie8753 said...

It looks like Charlie has those "movie clankers" to announce "take one".

Wow, talking to Charles Manson for 25 minutes....I think I'd rather watch paint dry.

What would it be like to have your phone ring at 3am when you're asleep and it's Charles Manson, ready to rap? And you can't shut him up to get off the phone.

Oh hi Charlie, how's it going?

It's going good. I've got a new girl under wraps.

Oh...that's nice...well I really gotta get going...

And she digs me, y'know? She grooves on my bag.

Oh, okay....well, my water's boiling so I'm just gonna...

And I think she'll do what I want, ya dig?

Yeah, that's great! Just gotta get goin' here...

Sometimes I see dead people.

Wow. I wondered if anybody really did that. Well...gotta hang up the phone.

The guard is watching me. He knows I'm talking to you.,

Okay, good! Gotta go for now. I'll catch you on the flip/flop. Byeeee.


LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I added some related excerpts from Sanders' book.
Specifically, the timeline I was looking for...

Turns out... I was right.
Rosalie stuck by Manson for just under a year.
Then, she bailed.

In the end, Manson served exactly 2 years, five months and 5 days.

If Rosalie had held-on for another year and a half, Manson would have been reunited with her, and their child.

It's gotta kinda suck, when a woman can't wait 2 1/2 years for ya.

But then again, that's women... LOL

Sanders corroborates what Beauders said, earlier.
Manson was none to happy, about the whole ordeal.

Manson's mother (as Beauders said) always maintained that Rosalie's departure was a huge blow to Manson, and a central catalyst for things to come.

Since Rosalie was living with Manson's mother during that entire time (almost a year)... I tend to give Kathleen's testimony some credence.

I mean... Kathleen Maddox was right there.
She oughtta know something...


beauders said...

I've had two really remarkable experiences in my life. the first being as a fourteen year old I went to the people's temple (of Jonestown fame) auction in san Francisco after the massacre in Guyana. it changed my life and was the first of my so called 'odd' interests. the second was a little more fun and that is a friend and I snuck into mtv's first new years party in new york city. the music was provided by david johanssen, karla DeVito, and bow bow wow. it was quite the eye opener for a sixteen year old from suburban Portland Oregon. lets just say it was the best party of my life. david johannsen put out an album shortly after the party with a crowd shot from the party and i'm standing there in it.

Venus said...

Re: the first paragraph excerpt. It ends "All was." All was what??????

Anonymous said...

i'm not sure what your blog is about, but i grew up in the town that rosalie moved to after she left manson. she married a man named white and charles jr changed his name to jay. the son died, supposedly committed suicide, in 1993. the wife died a few years ago. they kept to themselves and the son was ridiculed and avoided.

there are many stories that don't necessarily add up. we joke that there must be at least 4 charlie mansons for all the stories to be true. charlie was a criminal. he was a real criminal. ever hear of steubenville, ohio? supposedly charlie lived in our town for a while too, but it doesn't match the official time line so we aren't sure.

i'm interested in any evidence that he was a gypsy. has anyone heard that before? his mother died in oregon, which has the highest concentration of self-identified gypsies in the country. next is west virginia. thanks in advance.

Anonymous said...

sorry, kathleen died in spokane, wa, not oregon. but there are also gypsies in spokane. the marks family is very famous and zeke marks was buried in weirton, wv.



Anonymous said...

and i just read on your website that kathleen married a bower from spokane. bower is a well-known gypsy name. and rosalie's last name was willis. white is also a gypsy name, but it's not on this list.


Most surnames used by Gypsies are also common in the "Gorjer" or non-Gypsy population. The best known and most widespread Gypsy families include:

Boswell, Buckland, Faa, Hearn, Heron, Lee, Lovell, Smith, Wood, Young.

The following families all travelled in southern England:

Ayres, Baker, Ball, Barnes, Barney, Bartlett, Bath, Beaney, Beckett, Birch, Black, Blackman, Bland, Bowers, Brazil, Buckley, Bull, Burton, Bushnell, Butler, Camfield, Carey, Carrington, Castle, Chapman, Clark, Cole/Coles, Collins, Coneley, Cooper, Cox, Cripps, Crocker, Crutcher/Croucher/Kircher, Curtis, Davis/Davies, Dawes, Deacon/Deakins, Dixon, Doe, Draper, Duckett, Eastwood, Elliot, Essex, Frankham, Giles, Golby, Green, Gregory, Griggs, Gritt, Groves, Hall, Harfield, Harris, Hibberd, Hicks, Hughes, Isaacs, James, Jeffs, Johnson, Jones, Keet, Kempster, King, Kircher, Lakey, Lamb, Lambert, Lane, Light, Loveridge, Matthews, Miller, Mills, Mitchell, Mustow, Newland, Odam, Orchard, Page, Pannell, Parker, Pateman, Penfold/Pinfold, Peters, Pidgley, Pike, Proudley, Rawlings/Rollins, Ray, Roberts, Rose, Rowell, Rowland/Rowlands, Sanders/Saunders, Scamp, Scott, Sheen, Sherred/Sherrard, Sherwood, Sines, Small, Stanley, Stevens/Stephens, Stokes, Stratton, Tanner, Taylor, Thompson, Turner, Vincent, Wells, Wenman, Wheeler, White, Willett, Williams, Willis.

Doc Sierra said...

I remember a Gypsy family in Sacramento, CA named O'Leary. They were well known in Sacramento for living illegally on a houseboat on either the Sacramento River or the Feather River and I used to see their names in the Sacramento Bee newspaper quite ofter for getting busted for various scams. They had a daughter that was a straight up knock out. I wonder what happened to them.

AngelBaby said...

If Charles was a Gypsy, he was automatically shunned for his crimes as it would have brought such attention to an already bullied bloodline. And although most Travelers or Gypsies come from some ethnic groups, those groups compare the "N" word as the same as the "Gypsy" word. But still, there are those who within their ethnic cultures believe being a gypsy is cool or even part of their birthright. Example: My dad was Elvis, so i might want to be just like him.
Most gypsies are uneducated and no nothing else than to make the best of what they feel are owed. But their are ethnic groups like Romani that are trying to modernize their ways of life as quickly as possibly to catch up within the laws of U.S. Keeping their children in public school after puberty, or not arranging marriages have been a difficult one. If Charles was a Gypsy, He was a pshycopathic one. Nothing he did would even resemble a gypsies way of life. Most of them are non violent, they remain hidden, and by the time you realize your wallet is gone,,,they've already left the area. If charles was a form of gypsy, he'd be a Vlax, more from western europe, eastern Russia. Now those are some crazy F$%King gypsies. their rules are little bit different on how they get your wallet. example: like walk right into your unlocked apartment and hit your granny over the head with a ball peen hammer and take her purse and leave her bleeding on the floor type gypsy. Good luck trying to prove that charles was a gypsy, if someone proves it though, then you might have to admit more than a quarter of our population is not being controlled by some type of organised crime familes. Anytime their is more than a few people commiting a crime, it now becomes a conspiracy.....automatic Felony. DPS and local law enforcement, then US marshal and attorney general, then FBI and now ICE and Homeland Security will be knocking at your door. Good Luck!

AngelBaby said...

Oh!......And how did I come to this page, I am currently looking for a gypsy name Candy Stevens. Thats how I Know what im talking about. So any Romani's or gypsy supporters that want to comment about how I dont know what Im talking about, be sure you use a fake email, as I will be running it thru my data base to locate, verify and connect families together to find others I am looking for. Good Day!