Saturday, September 24, 2011

Mary Writes: 
"I was thinking about commenting today on the thread that had several comments on ATWA.  But the subject has been changed by now...but I am still interested.

Can we open up the floor to the ATWA worshippers?
I want to know what ATWA is doing in regards to the environment.  I would like for them to explain.  Their website is never working it seems... so I am having problems getting actual information about them.  It would be interesting for them to articulate how they feel ATWA is helping the environment".
 
Lynyrd Responds:  "Have at it" ATWA people!  Here's your chance to share information, links, websites... whatevers.  The floor is yours! 
Thanks Mary!!

123 comments:

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

"Beanie"... I see you added yourself as a follower.

Welcome to the blog!!
I hope to see you in the comments section!

Peace... Lynyrd

FrankM said...

Now this ATWA business, is there any clear person or body that speaks - or claims to speak - for ATWA?

What I see on the Internet is that there are half a dozen or so semi-active sites and a couple of forums that speak of ATWA. Some of these are really quite sleepy. There are most probably others I know nothing of.

What I don't see is any coherent link between these websites, any apparent organisational structure or any indication as to who might be some kind of 'official' representative.

I fear that the truth might be that ATWA is a bit like Al-Qaeda, with odds and sods of people in far flung places united by a vague sense of common purpose but whose activities are not orchestrated by any central body.

Comments, anyone?

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Frank I get the feeling you're right. If you go to Mansondirect.com (An ATWA site) you see Charlie's picture and ways to contact Charlie. I don't know who runs that website. It's basically just a platform for Charlie to run his mouth.

I did see one website a while back that changed "ATWA to "ATWAR". Don't know what happened to that one. I'm thinking it was Sandy Good that was running it.

v717 said...

So you wanna learn about ATWA.
Here it is.
http://airtreeswateranimals.blogspot.com/feeds/posts/default

v717 said...

Try this link instead.

v717 said...

This link
http://airtreeswateranimals.blogspot.com/

katie8753 said...

V717, is this website related to the one you posted?

http://www.allthewayalive.com/One_World_Order/contents.html

v717 said...

Katie 8753
At the bottom of the site I posted there is some links. If you click on "On World Order. Central Source for ATWA and Charles Manson."
You are directed to the page that you posted

FrankM said...

I went to http://airtreeswateranimals.blogspot.com/.

A few posts going back a bit. Lots of links to other ATWA sites. No comments. No contact details or attributions.

Of interest is this brief snapshot of the Manson family life - I quote at length because it is so saccharine:

Manson was released from federal prison on the Spring Equinox of 1967, that spring grew into what has been called the ‘’Summer of Love’’. Manson, who’s nickname in the Haight-Ashbury district of San Francisco was ‘’the Gardner’’ gathered a few flower-children and traveled to the Redwoods of northern Californa through the rainforests of the Pacific Northwest to the deserts of Mojave, Arizona and New Mexico. They explored, adventured, camped and climbed all over the western part of the U.S. until settling at Spahn Ranch in the Santa Susana Mountains of California’s chaparral and woodlands bioregion. Striking a deal with the ranch’s owner to help maintain the ranch by taking care of 83 horses, and numerous other animals, Manson and his campfire band sometimes known as ‘the Family Jams’ lived a rugged, spartan life without electricity, television or other modern luxuries. They used no clocks or calendars, relying on the sun and moon to tell time. The ranch had a garden but much of the food was collected from throwaway bins at the edge of the city. Large vegetarian meals were created nightly which sometimes fed up to 40 or 50 people all from perfectly edible produce collected on ‘’garbage runs’’. The ranch had a bathhouse, a stream and a waterfall for washing and outhouses instead of a polluting sewer system. The ranch women gave birth naturally without doctors and wore no makeup. When Manson’s son was born he named him Sun Stone Hawk, the stone being the Earth. Animals and children were considered sacred because of their heightened state of awareness and everyone who lived with Manson noted his profound ability to communicate with and show love and compassionate understanding towards animals. Sewing and embroidery was a cherished, creative meditation among the ranch women and the overall reality of life at the ranch was something of a new psychedelic version of old western pioneer life, In 1968, Manson and the shifting band of ranch hands took excursions into the deepest corners of Death Valley, exploring the mountains, caves, dunes and saltflats of the lowest land on Earth, eventually working to create an oasis of life far from the confusion and madness of the cities. Manson’s lyrics in the song ‘’Sick City’’ reflect this thought clearly.... (more on this to come)

A new and idyllic slant, certainly - no guns, no drugs, no crime, no violence, no strip and suck, no abuse, no sex, no police, no arrests, no creepy crawly, no murder ..

It's always nice to see another view of things, even a self-serving, delusional view like this.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Thanks Frank. A few notes for whoever wrote this:

>>>Manson, who’s nickname in the Haight-Ashbury district of San Francisco was ‘’the Gardner’’>>>

That should be "whose", not "who's"

>>>....lived a rugged, spartan life without electricity, television or other modern luxuries.>>>

If they didn't have electricity, how did they have a phone and how did they watch the news reports about the murders at Cielo Drive?

>>>The ranch had a bathhouse, a stream and a waterfall for washing and outhouses instead of a polluting sewer system.>>>

That must have smelled good. LOL.

>>>The ranch women gave birth naturally without doctors and wore no makeup.>>>

Okay....and this helped the environment how??

>>>Animals and children were considered sacred because of their heightened state of awareness>>>

The children were molested and the horses were bitten bloody by the horse flies.

>>>the overall reality of life at the ranch was something of a new psychedelic version of old western pioneer life>>>

Yeah, like The Rifleman on crack!

>>Manson and the shifting band of ranch hands took excursions into the deepest corners of Death Valley, exploring the mountains, caves, dunes and saltflats of the lowest land on Earth, eventually working to create an oasis of life far from the confusion and madness of the cities.>>>

And while they were there, they snuffed out and buried certain folks, potential snitches and probable escapees.

Wow. It really sounds good when you re-write it. HA HA.

katie8753 said...

V717, these websites regarding ATWA, are they all connected?

In other words, are they all written by the same people?

v717 said...

Frank M said
It's always nice to see another view of things, even a self-serving, delusional view like this.
"If all people in the world should have the same living standars as we in the West have, we would have to have five to six planets by the size of the Earth to achive that.
So you tell me what is delusional or not."

katie8753 said...

>>>V717 said: "If all people in the world should have the same living standars as we in the West have, we would have to have five to six planets by the size of the Earth to achive that.>>>

What does that even MEAN????

We in the west? West of what? Please clarify the area you are describing.

There are plenty of people here in the US that are living in tents, in homeless shelters, on top of each other because of poverty.

Please expound.

v717 said...

Katie 8753
If they didn't have electricity, how did they have a phone and how did they watch the news reports about the murders at Cielo Drive?
"There was a trailer that belonged to old George that had a TV-set.
There was also a phone somewhere so people could phone the Ranch and book riding lessons. That phone also belonged to the Ranch and George Spahn.
Are the websites written by the same people?
"They are written by people who share the same opinion about life on the planet Earth."

v717 said...

Katie 8753
List of countries by percentage living in powerty.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_percentage_of_population_living_in_poverty

katie8753 said...

V717, without electricity, there is no phone or TV.

So if there was a phone or TV at Spahn's', there was electricity at the ranch. Period.

And please explain your comment about all the planets. Makes no sense.

v717 said...

Katie8753
And please explain your comment about all the planets. Makes no sense.
"The planet Earth is running out of resources. One example: We have probably reached the peak of oil. That means that in the future we can´t go on driving cars because the petrol will be so expensive that nobody can afford to fill the tank, and so on.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I haven't cruised the ATWA circuit in 3-4 years... but, the last time I did... my experience was just as Frank described.

All the sites linked to each other... and I never got anywhere solid.

The sites had no clear-cut agenda... or documentation as to how, or if, they were meeting their goals.

I'm not sure if things have changed in recent years.

The whole experience reminded me more of a "clique/club" where folks socialized with friends, than a professional organization.

Maybe there's more out there now, that I haven't seen...

FrankM said...

v717 asks...

so you tell me what is delusional or not

Certainly. The passage I quoted describes an idyllic world of concerned, enlightened and ecologically principled young people living in peace and tranquility.

It completely fails to mention the (stolen) automobile body parts strewn around the place, the general filth and squalor, the abusive treatment of young women and children, the drug abuse, the low-level crime, the presence of criminal biker gangs, the increasingly violent and irrational behaviour of Manson himself, the forages for credit cards, dumpster food and other opportunism, etc. I'll stop there, but you get my point.

Oh, yes, I forgot the murders - they might have been worthy of mention too, I guess. And your description of CM as a saintly mystic is equally indicative of a kind of selective amnesia. If you really believe all in that paragraph I quoted in my earlier mail, and fail to accept what I am highlighting in this mail, then (IMHO) you are truly deluded.

I guess my point is, v717, that you can't really paint a picture of life at Spahn and Barker using pastel colours only. You need the whole paint box, with a good deal of purple, crimson and black on the palette to paint the bruised and battered.

FrankM

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Thank You Frank.
I couldn't have expressed that better myself.

Over the years... the entire "family experience", has morphed into a completely romanticized utopia of good-will and scruples with some folks.

Truth is... these folks were criminals... abusing themselves, others and society.
These folks exploited everything and everyone... yes, including their surroundings.

We're so many years removed... it seems easy... even popular, to distort the reality of what these folks were... what they really represented... and how they lived.

The idealistic values of some of these groups is admirable... but, how it ties-in with Manson, or his band of criminals, makes no sense to me.

I dare say... ATWA would probably have grown in size and effectiveness with the general public over the years... if they had removed all traces of Manson from their group/sites.
Most mainstream environmentalists probably take one gander of Manson on these sites... and exit.

katie8753 said...

>>>Lynyrd said: I dare say... ATWA would probably have grown in size and effectiveness with the general public over the years... if they had removed all traces of Manson from their group/sites.
Most mainstream environmentalists probably take one gander of Manson on these sites... and exit.>>>

Lynyrd that's true. But you have to keep in mind that the ONLY reason this ATWA stuff was started was as a means to minimize Charlie's "evilness" and redevelop his character as a loving, giving, caring person. As such, they had to mention Manson.

It's a shame that after all these years, so many young people who are discovering this "new" Charlie have bought into his "environmental guru" stuff.

A lot of effort has gone into minimizing the events that took place in 1969 in order to make Charlie look better.

And that's the goal of this ATWA group....not so much to save the environment....but to perhaps one day get Charlie released.

FrankM said...

"The planet Earth is running out of resources. One example: We have probably reached the peak of oil. That means that in the future we can´t go on driving cars because the petrol will be so expensive that nobody can afford to fill the tank, and so on.

This would explain why Manson stockpiled fuel in the desert, and built up his dune buggy battalion, would it?

But do stop and think for a moment. Cars today run on a variety of fuels - hydrogen, sugar cane alcohol, electricity, etc. with other ongoing research. And scientists today are probably more ecologically minded than Charlie Manson ever was. There is really no reason for now why we should not go on driving cars - though plenty of reasons why we might rationalise their use.

I'm not denying there were some environmentally conscious people back then, even at Spahn and Barker - that would have been in tune with the times. But not to the extent that you are trying to make CM into a green guru.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Actually V717, there is plenty of oil. We've not even begun to deplete that resource.

I think the real reason for the alternative fueling for cars is the constant fighting over the oil with the middle east and the constant price hikes.

katie8753 said...

ATWA doesn't mention the black eyes, bloody noses and knocked out teeth of young girls who didn't bow to Charlie's wishes, the rapes of young girls who didn't want to have sex with him, the visceral fear that his former musical associates felt regarding him, the audible and implied threats toward family members who decided they'd had enough and wished to leave, etc. ,etc.

v717 said...

Frank M mentions stolen cars, drug abuse, low-level crimes and so on. Funny but I thought it was for something else Manson been in prison for the last 42 years.
The murders. Yes, but I haven´t so far on this blog seen a "tiny bit of evidence" that connect Manson to those murders. Except of course that everybody here seems to have been wrapped up in Vincent bogus Bugs HELTER SKELTER book. If there ever was a master manipulator of naive people that man surely is Vincent Bug. Manson is nothing to him in comparison.
LynyrdSkynyrdBand says that these folks were criminals. But that is also what Manson says. Manson: "i´m a petty car thief." Nothing new here.
And Katie 8753 says: "The ONLY reason this ATWA stuff was started was as a means to minimize Charlie's "evilness" and redevelop his character as a loving, giving, caring person; and of course also to get him free."
Manson says: "You must learn to stand up for yourself. I can´t do that for you." Manson don´t care for people that can´t take care of themselves. Katie, I assure you, the only thing Manson cares about is ATWA.
Everybody seems to think that it´s nothing wrong with environmental movements as long as Manson is not involved. You can thank Bug for that.

FrankM said...

v717 - this is simply disingenuous. Either you fail to understand the point I made, clearly and twice, or you choose to ignore it.

I was questioning the false 'idyll' delineated in the passage you quoted, and you choose to reply with comments on sentencing, Bugliosi, portrayals of Manson's character, etc.

I ask you - for the third time now - do you think the way that life at Spahn and Barker, as described in the passage I quoted (and leaving out the nasty bits I suggested had been omitted), is a fair portrayal of how it was?

Is that clear enough for you? Can you give a simple yea or nay?

FrankM

FrankM said...

V717 says

I haven´t so far on this blog seen a "tiny bit of evidence" that connect Manson to those murders

Interesting. I wonder if you’ve read much of it – there’s quite a lot going back over the years.

Let’s see: ‘connect Manson to the murders’.

Well, he lived with the self-confessed murderers much of the time, ate with them, had sex with some of them and did dope with some of them.

All of them have since denounced him as being involved.

He himself has stated that he went up to Cielo Drive after the murders to see what his children had done.

He himself has said he went to the La Biancas and tied up the hapless couple (presumably ‘connected’ in some way to the killing.

You know, I was going to go on, but really can’t be bothered. Either you’re a troll, or in denial. If you want to continue this ostrich behavior I guess it’s your right, but I’m going to have to exercise some self control and stop rising to the bait.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

>>>V717 said: The murders. Yes, but I haven´t so far on this blog seen a "tiny bit of evidence" that connect Manson to those murders.>>>

V717, have you been napping again? Are you having out-of-body experiences that leave big gaps in your memory?

I really don't want to get out the TLB 101 primer and start from scratch. We've all completed the course and it sounds like you're just now getting to school.

>>>Katie, I assure you, the only thing Manson cares about is ATWA.>>>

When Charlie made this statement, explain what part of ATWA he was talking about:

"Maybe I should have killed 400 or 500 people. Then I would have felt better."

Charlie's solution to overpopulation is to kill 10's of 1,000's of people.

Questions: How did he comprise the list of people? Is he on the list?

v717 said...

FrankM
Was it heaven or hell at Spahn Ranch? I don´t know I wasn´t there.
But I would say that it probably was a damn mess. To much drugs, to much out of control, to much of people who didn´t have nowhere to go. These people were drifters, small time criminals, outcasts and so on. It´s important to understand that it was not some kind of Hippie commune. These people wasn´t Hippies. In fact they hated Hippies. They were Slippies for they had slipped out of society for good.
Yes, I think a very good painter could reproduce such a lifestyle in pastel colours only. Truth or false? It´s in the eyes of the beholder. What you see or not, It´s all there.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

V717:

Are you suggesting that auto theft, soliciting drugs, dealing drugs, credit card fraud, sex with minors, prostitution (Manson was pimping before the family even began)... vandalizing equipment (worth probably half a million dollars in today's money)... are all PETTY crimes????

V717:
What crime besides murder, would you suggest is not petty?

v717 said...

FrankM
Yes he knew the murders and so on.
What does that prove? Nothing.
Manson isn´t convicted for murder but for "Conspiracy to murder."
And that is of course the merit of Vincent.
Katie 8753
>>>Katie, I assure you, the only thing Manson cares about is ATWA.>>>
It was I who said that, not Manson.
"Maybe I should have killed 400 or 500 people. Then I would have felt better."
That was just a cruel joke from Manson.
Katie, I don´t know what hit-list you are talking about.
But I know that at the end of the day Manson will still be here.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLBsuWhC2YM

v717 said...

LynyrdSkynyrdBand
They were criminals I know. I have never denied that.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

"Ostrich Behavior"

What a fabulous description...

It's a bit more kind, than "head up"..... the other obvious place.
(which is what I was thinking)

V717...
I'm returning to my policy of ignoring your posts.
I'll let Katie entertain you at the "kiddies table" once again.
Periodically, I try bringing you up to the "adult's table"... but it never works-out.

V717...
You talk in circles, and never answer anything directly.

FrankM said...

Agreed, LS, let the troll well alone.

Here is some suggested compensation for wasted time, from Baudelaire:

The man of intelligence [snip] should cultivate pleasure in the conversation of imbeciles and the study of worthless books. From these he will derive sardonic amusement which will largely repay him for his pains.

FrankM

v717 said...

I tell you one thing FrankM and LynyrdSkynyrdBand. You are trying to solve these murders. But you haven´t got a single clue of what this is all about. This is not a simple criminal-case. It´s much bigger than that and much more extensive than you ever could dream about. So, good luck!

katie8753 said...

>>>V717 said: You are trying to solve these murders. But you haven´t got a single clue of what this is all about.>>>

Well...according to your good buddy Charlie, Sharon Tate's death wasn't murder....it was a holy war and justified.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mx_QP-bevwY&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PL21219F92A614466A

FrankM said...

V717

If you have something to share, something you can support with some reasonably compelling evidence, then do please share it with us, but don't go down the Wheat/Salem route of "I have the answers but I'm not going to tell you", because it sucks.

Putting it more bluntly, crap or get off the pot.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Has anybody ever noticed that ANY time Charlie is asked if he had remorse or even felt bad about people being hacked to pieces, he ALWAYS responds by saying "Why should I feel bad. I got my teeth knocked out in prison...society did this to me", or whatever injury du jour that he sustained by "the man" he likes to share.

This is what people like V717 need to understand.

Charlie will never accept responsibility for anything he has ever done or will ever do. He will always blame it on society. He feels justified for everything that happened because of his history....and the sad thing is he has only himself to blame for being brought up in the system.

It was his choice to steal & pimp and keep getting thrown back in prison.

Nobody's fault but HIS!!!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

V717 said:
>>>>"I tell you one thing FrankM and LynyrdSkynyrdBand. You are trying to solve these murders. But you haven´t got a single clue of what this is all about".<<<<

Oh Really?
Lynyrd and Frank don't have a clue?

Here's a clue:

Your friend, shaman, guru, enlightened one, prophet, love, "soul", reflection... rots in prison... because he acted like a complete fool during his own trial.
That's right V717...
Manson's incarceration had much less to do with Vincent Bugliosi, than you proclaim.

----------------------------------------------------------

Why did Manson act like a fool?

-Maybe he IS a fool.
-Maybe he was trying to prove a point... which he didn't.
-Maybe he thought he was immune, because he never physically killed anyone.
-Maybe he wanted to go back to jail.

Truth is... I really don't give a crap... and in 2011, it doesn't matter.

Bugliosi was NOT the prosecutor, judge and jury.
He was just the prosecutor.
Prosecutors DO lose cases... in case you didn't know that.
A jury convicted your shaman, because he acted like an ass-clown.

You got it now?!!

Manson placed himself in prison, and he will certainly die there.

And quite frankly...
Any man too stupid to behave himself in a court of law, while his entire life hangs in the balance... doesn't deserve freedom, OR sympathy.

You wanna buy another clue?!

FrankM said...

And now it's time for a cup of tea, Lynyrd.

FrankM

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

I agree with everyone so far about this ATWA business with the obvious exception of v717 who appears to be located in a much different dimension that the one we are currently in.

There does not appear to be any real structure to the ATWA organization as far as I can tell. In fact it looks really fragmented with all kinds of different factions competing to be the "real voice" of the movement. Add to that the revisionist "Manson Family" history they are busy propagating and things look pretty grim.

It seems odd to me that people who could perhaps shed some light on this subject have chosen to remain silent....why just a week ago "Hippie Scholar" was practically the ruling authority on ATWA with all kinds of inside info and sources..why so silent now?

katie8753 said...

Hi Miss Spiritual Tramp!

I agree with you. I, for one, would like those out there that support this ATWA "movement" to prove their claims that Charlie was trying to save the environment BEFORE the murders.

And I mean proof. Evidence that it was the case. Not just "well I know because Charlie said" or "I know but I can't tell you how".

Proof that Charlie was talking just as much about the environment as he was trying to get recording sessions, directing drug orgies, rapping about the end of the world and the "hole in the desert", throwing knives at people and asking if they would "die for him", beating up women, burning loaders, shooting drug dealers, cutting off musician's ears, stealing cars and credit cards, pimping, bribing motorcycle gangs to live at the ranch, making sure no one wore glasses (which he wears now), birthing babies in unsanitary conditions and, of course, ordering murders.

Anybody???

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Hi Katie.....I guess ATWA must be too busy saving the planet or planning Charlie's 2012 release party to make time for us...

Hippie Scholar is probably on route to Denver as we speak hoping to get a coveted spot in the HUGE underground base which exists under the airport...best of luck to him.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

LOLOL

I LOVE this Spiritual Tramp Lady!

Spiritual Tramp... You ROCK!!!

I think she's gonna fit right in. : )

katie8753 said...

Well said, Miss Spiritual Tramp (I think I'll call you Missy from now on. It's easier to type. LOL).

You could well be right about Jimmy. He may be racing to Denver as we speak. And....Denver is the only safe haven in this country? I thought the "underground bunkers" were in the northeast. LOL.

I know the ATWA fans like to talk. Well, here's their chance! They may be busy planning Charlie's release party, but they better be figuring out who is going to be "keeping him" because he won't be able to live alone.

Maybe they can do shifts. 12 on and 12 off. HA HA HA.

katie8753 said...

Charlie's last words on his death bed will be "save....the....environment.....gasp".

HA HA.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Thanks Lynyrd!! I truly appreciate your kind words.

As a long time lurker I never imagined I would actually ever post here..that changed last week when I literally could not take any more of Hippie Scholar (and I believe he was also speaking on behalf of ATWA as well..I seem to recall a nameless inside source) attacking Michael and his "fans".

Thanks again for making me feel welcome here.

FrankM said...

Hippie Scholar has been around a long time under many names and has alienated most everyone. He changes his position and focus regularly, and rarely makes much sense.

LIke v717, probably best to simply deny him the oxygen of acknowledgment.

FrankM

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Believe me Spiritual...

Jim has antagonized MANY would-be lurkers into posting over the years!
Ahahahaha

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Katie said:
>>>>"Charlie's last words on his death bed will be "save....the....environment.....gasp".<<<<

Manson gasping for breath:

"Give me air, trees, water, ani-"...
"Fuck it... just give me AIR"!
AHahahaha

katie8753 said...

Frank, I know I've said this before...but I'll say it again.

You are the most eloquent and expressive blogger I think I've ever seen, and I enjoy your posts immensely! Your English and grammar are impeccable, and your knowledge of this case is undeniable.

Please keep your comments coming!!

FrankM said...

Katie - you'd better sit down and have a cup of tea too.

But flattery will get you everywhere!

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Frank I sincerely mean that. You are the "Shakespeare" of this, or any blog. And I'll tell you what, Shakespeare was one hot dude!! That guy could take any situation and explain it in Elizabethan terms, and we still understand it. HA HA.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Lynyrd said:

Jim has antagonized MANY would-be lurkers into posting over the years!
Ahahahaha

>>well at least he serves a purpose other than running amok in cyberspace so thats a postive.

I would be willing to bet that his buddies at ATWA were not impressed at all with his performance here last week.
Perhaps he was sanctioned or something...like forbidden to ever speak of ATWA on a Manson blog..sounds plausible to me and probably a wise move on the part of ATWA.

katie8753 said...

I, for one, get so tired of people who can't spell or express themselves with any kind of knowledge of the English language.

It's like a fingernail on a blackboard to me.

But...that's just me.

BTW, for anyone who is listening, the ... is called an elipsis. It means a pause of words, or an omission of words.

Just food for thought for the hungry.

Also, another angry favorite of mine, it's not "unquote", it's "end quote" after a quotation of someone speaking. I even hear this mispronunciation on the news!!

Grrrrrrr...... (elipsis). HA HA.

FrankM said...

I can write because I worked for many years as a hack journalist - or should that be the other way round? And I went to school when reading and writing were still prized. THere was no television in my house when I was young, and obviously no computer - this was in the 40s and 50s. What there were were a lot of books, and I was a prolific reader. My family is actually from England, although I was born and have lived my whole life in Greenpoint, and I was raised on English language classics, more British than American.

But I'd rather be praised for courtesy, reason and moderation - I'm one of those guys who come from the mind rather than the heart. One of my aims in life (I have an active life outside TLB) is to bring these qualities to a number of the wilder blogs I frequent.

Which is why I step back when Wheat or Savage (or their ilk) are around.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Well Frank, I commend you on your command of the language, I figured you were from England, but nevertheless, I was an avid scholar of the English language in school, I found it very interesting. In fact, I was going to be a writer, so I was very good at English and literature.

I do commend you on your courtesy, reason and moderation on all comments. I didn't mean to discount you on those items at all. I feel that you are well "above board" on all accounts.

I used to read your comments years ago at the Col's blog, and felt the same way.

Here's to you. I've seen you bashed several times at certain locations, but still feel that you are "top of the line" when it comes to bloggers.

Not disingenuous flattery, but sincere compliments.

A cup of tea to you as well!!!

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

I am very interested in the political position ATWA assumes which I cannot seem to find anywhere.

Do they support/endorse a Presidential canidate at election time? Do they even support liberal democracy? Are they at all concerned about Newt Gingrich becomming the leader of the Republican party???

So many questions....COME ON ATWA SPEAK TO ME.......

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

And I too agree with Katie..FrankM is a class act with a admirable writing style to say the least.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Katie...I think your passion and unfiltered honesty is awesome.

I know it gets you in trouble sometimes but at least you are alive inside and actually have a point of view. There is nothing wrong with that, in fact more people should have one and actually try to think for themselves.

Okay so it looks like ATWA is NOT COMMING TO THIS PARTY!! Maybe there is something to this Elenin hocus pocus.. maybe its not a PSY OP..I better go see if there are any flights to Denver that I can catch ASAP..GOODNIGHT

katie8753 said...

Missy, I agree, what political platform do they support?

I know Manson hates Nixon, who declared him guilty, which means he hates the Republicans, but who do they support? Not that I care.

They don't seem to make any differential toward any particular party platform.

They never have that I know of. Of course, I don't know anything about them, so now is their time to speak.

It seems strange that they like to talk a lot about the environment, but now they are suddenly mute? This is their chance to speak their minds.

I have to say, that ATWA is never disconnected from Charlie.

And, as I've said before, Charlie is the mouthpiece for this organization.

So why is Charlie suddenly struck dumb? Why are his cohorts suddenly struck dumb?

There are a legion of them that would say otherwise. Why are they not saying it?

Could it be that they are afraid?

katie8753 said...

Oh, and to anyone who is going to provide assistance to Charlie when he's released (Star??, AC??) you'll need to provide medical care insurance and dental insurance, because Medicare won't pay for it.

You'll need to take out plans on an 80 year old guy, which will probably cost you around $2000/month. And the deductible will probably be $50,000/year.

Not to mention around the clock medical care, which will cost you around $1000/day.

Unless you are going to provide it yourselves.

Changing bedpans, shaving, brushing his teeth, helping him eat.

So make sure you save your pennies.

HA HA HA.

Can't wait to get that old geyser released. It'll be like bringing the turkey home.

I can't wait until Charlie sees what life is like outside the California tax payers paying for his existence.

HA HA HA.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Frank is certainly one of the most intelligent folks in cyberspace... there's no doubt about that.

katie8753 said...

Charles Milles Manson.

Yeah he's a character. Did he orchestrate ATWA. Yes and no.

He told his minions after his death sentence to start it up.

And his stupid minions did just that. Sandy and skinny loser. They made it all up. To get him out.

Charles Milles Manson a/k/a The Soul, a/k/a Jesus Christ, a/k/a the Devil.

Wow. What a trip! HA HA.

He killed more people than you can imagine. But his minions say he didn't. Wow!!! How do you get away with that??? How do you get some homely girls to say you didn't murder, and crusade for a lifetime??? And keep sucking your dick?

How do you do that?

Well I'll tell you how. You tell them that you love them. Period.

It used to work back then. Sorry if it doesn't now.

Women's lib and all that. HA HA.

katie8753 said...

"Me thinks thou did protest too much."

Porque no hablas?

HA HA HA.

beauders said...

atwa was created after the murder trials to give manson good p.r. nothing more--these people were not environmentalists when they were together--they were only interested in sex, drugs, and rock'n'roll and then murder.

beauders said...

also another manson 101 lecture should be on what manson was convicted of and sentenced to death for. he is not in prison on a charge of conspiracy to commit murder only. manson was convicted of eight felonies with tate/ labianca murders--seven first degree murder convictions and one count of conspiracy to commit murder. he is in prison for murder.

katie8753 said...

THANKS Beauders!

That's exactly what I've been saying all along. There was no ATWA until AFTER Charlie was convicted, and the only reason it was created was to try to make Charlie look better.

Now it's just a platform for Charlie to continue his rants about various things.

whiskybeauty said...

>>>The ranch women gave birth naturally without doctors and wore no makeup.>>>

Didn't Sandy have her son in hospital? I'm sure I read somewhere one of the women did and seem to have her in mind.

>>>everyone who lived with Manson noted his profound ability to communicate with and show love and compassionate understanding towards animals. >>>

I know it's been trotted out many times but...Hitler loved animals too! Too bad the love doesn't extend to humans :)

katie8753 said...

Hi Whiskeybeauty!!! Good to see you!

Yes Sandy did have her baby in the hospital. I guess after seeing all those other births at the ranch, she figured she'd rather be around people with medical know-how. I seem to remember that it mad Charlie mad, but I guess he forgave her. HA HA.

Charlie did admire Hitler. There are some who will deny this, but it seems odd that the symbol he would chose for his forehead would be a swastika if he didn't think much of him. LOL.

FrankM said...

I think it was a cross at first - he X'd himself out of our world. He converted it into a swastika later.

But the swastika symbol (Fylfot) is much older than National Socialism and Hitler, and there's no way really to second guess his reasoning.

FrankM

katie8753 said...

Thanks Frank. I haven't researched the history of the swastika. I thought Hitler was the first to use it. I guess because he is the one who made it evil.

Didn't Hitler also use the Iron Cross, or as we called it back in the 60's, the Surfer's Cross?

FrankM said...

The Iron Cross had nothing to do with Hitler in particular (although was awarded during his command) - it is/was a military decoration used in Germany (or what is/was Germany) since the beginning of the C19th.

The design is based on a cross used by Teutonic knights in the C13th and C14th.

FrankM

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hello Beauders!

Beauders said:
>>>>"atwa was created after the murder trials to give manson good p.r. nothing more--these people were not environmentalists when they were together--they were only interested in sex, drugs, and rock'n'roll and then murder".<<<<

Thank You Beauders... for all your contributions!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Wow Whiskey-Beauty!!

A blast from my very, very distant YouTube past!

It's so great to see you... you've gotta visit more often!

I hope you're doing well!

Peace... Lynyrd

Mary said...

Miss Spiritual said - So many questions....COME ON ATWA SPEAK TO ME.......

I know what you mean MST...I am very disappointed that more did not respond to help us understand. I sincerely want to learn.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Hi Mary...I think this was a excellent thread topic.

Predictably however our ATWA friends remain eerily silent, seemingly not interested in sharing their organization's ideas with the uninitiated.

I mean I get that they may not want to be bothered with what they may percieve to be hostile territory, but come on if you are truly committed to a cause and are confident in your position you would welcome this type of challenge as an opportunity.

Is ATWA really that complicated and esoteric that only the chosen ones get it?? I doubt it.

I will remind everyone that in the previous thread where this ATWA conversation initially began one HIPPIE SCHOLAR quoting the now infamous inside ATWA source stated the following:(what ATWA thinks of Michaels Backporch)

"And bpt has an audiance, an audiance of people with low education, mental and or intoxication issues or all kinds of ex-prisoners, not helpfull for our mission at all."

So I was wondering, does this MISSION you speak of involve any or all of the following items: ropes, buck knives, 22 caliber revolvers, bolt cutters, carving forks?

A simple yes or no will suffice.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I kinda thought AC might stop-in for a few words on ATWA... or, maybe Jim would carry the torch.

Oh well... no such luck.

katie8753 said...

>>>Missy said: I mean I get that they may not want to be bothered with what they may percieve to be hostile territory, but come on if you are truly committed to a cause and are confident in your position you would welcome this type of challenge as an opportunity.>>>

Missy, I agree.

I would like for someone connected with or familiar with ATWA to come on and explain exactly what ATWA is, and what exactly are they doing to help the environment...WITHOUT mentioning Charles Manson.

starship said...

Beauders, I admit that tooling around on the web would lead one to believe that CM was convicted of murder, however I believe he was charged with conspiracy to commit murder, which somehow makes V717 feel mitigates his responsibility.

So what happened under California law at the time, was that if you are convicted of conspiracy in a plot which actually resulted in the murder of another person, then all members of the conspiracy are held equally responsible, whether they were at the scene or not, whether they themselves killed anyone or not. This, to me, is certainly logical.

It is the same premise that gets the Col so excited about Bugliosi because he believes Bugliosi lied under oath during the trial about something or other, and the penalty for perjury in a death penalty case is death, with this caveat: someone actually had to have been executed as a result of such perjury.

And today is Sept 27th, and I am still using my computer to post to an internet blog. So far Elenin is a no show...

katie8753 said...

Hi Starship!

>>>Starship said: It is the same premise that gets the Col so excited about Bugliosi because he believes Bugliosi lied under oath during the trial about something or other, and the penalty for perjury in a death penalty case is death, with this caveat: someone actually had to have been executed.>>>

When was Bugliosi under oath during the trial?

katie8753 said...

Oh that's right, I forgot today was the day that Jimmy said the sky was going to fall. It's still up there so far. LOL.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Attention Hippie Scholar-DOOM CANCELLED-I repeat Doom has been cancelled.
Please exit the Denver underground immediately and report to this thread to enlighten us on ATWA.

katie8753 said...

Hi Missy.

Are you sure you want to invoke Jimmy? He might be kinda cranky since the comet-thingy didn't happen. HA HA.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Hi Katie...haha cranky Jimmy..is there any other kind of Jimmy?

To be fair there have been times when he appears to be lucid and rational and makes some valid points, it just does not happen that often.

And even though DOOM has been cancelled for now, I am fairly certain DOOM will be back on in a few days or even hours.

katie8753 said...

>>>To be fair there have been times when he appears to be lucid and rational and makes some valid points, it just does not happen that often.

And even though DOOM has been cancelled for now, I am fairly certain DOOM will be back on in a few days or even hours.>>>

Yeah Missy, if he would stick to the subject matter, it can be quite interesting at times.

But there's always something ominous going on in the Heavens. Next up, we'll have another "alien invasion". LOL.

bradley_nowell_805 said...

I think ATWA is just about conservation.....Air Trees Water and Animals.....I think it's self explanatory and I don't believe it's an oranization. I think that like the name Manson, people take the ATWA idea and take some liberties with it to make it their own.....ATWA is nature and the earth and the fact that the earth is a living being.....That's what I always thought ATWA was and is.....I think that people confuse and complicate it....ATWA is ATWA

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Katie said:

But there's always something ominous going on in the Heavens. Next up, we'll have another "alien invasion". LOL.

>>Thats right...the FAKE ALIEN INVASION...I totally forgot about that lunacy.

How did it go again... some movie producer by the name of Don Murphy is assisting the NEW WORLD ORDER in its final goal...THE TOTAL ENSLAVEMENT OF HUMANITY through his Transfomer films and Jimmy feels this Murphy character should be arrested as a result.

So if I understand correctly, the new Transformer movie is going to prime us for a fake alien invasion which will then really occur and martial law will be declared??

This conspiracy stuff gets so confusing and don't get me wrong I LOVE A GOOD CONSPIRACY..this is just godlikeproductions dot com lunatic fringe crap specifically targeted at an audience with wild imaginations and undernourished intellects.

katie8753 said...

Hi Bradley!

>>>Bradley said: I think ATWA is just about conservation.....Air Trees Water and Animals.....I think it's self explanatory and I don't believe it's an oranization.>>>

If it's not an organization, what is it? An imaginary force? A collective intelligence like the Borg?

>>>I think that like the name Manson, people take the ATWA idea and take some liberties with it to make it their own.....ATWA is nature and the earth and the fact that the earth is a living being>>>

Well then you're saying every website that advertises ATWA (including Charlie's) is fake? Because Air, Trees, Water and Animals can't run a website.

>>>.....ATWA is ATWA.>>>

But what does ATWA do?

katie8753 said...

Missy, you may or may not know that Don Murphy is Col Scott.

Jimmy doesn't like the Col or his movie Transformers. Therefore...he's come up with the ultimate evil doer taking over the world.

>>>So if I understand correctly, the new Transformer movie is going to prime us for a fake alien invasion which will then really occur and martial law will be declared??>>>

Yeah...sounds familiar right? Except the first time the story was told, the survivors would end up in a bottomless pit in the desert. HA HA.

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Katie said:

Missy, you may or may not know that Don Murphy is Col Scott.

>>>Oh yes I know DON=COL

katie8753 said...

Missy, I figured you probably knew that. :)

Miss Spiritual Tramp 1979 said...

Bradley--I get that in its purest form ATWA is ATWA and its about conservation which is fine, I don't think anyone would oppose that since we all have a vested interest in this planet and hence a common goal.

Where I get confused is with all the talk of "missions" and moralising.

I assume then the people on said missions are the same people responsible for hijacking or taking liberties as you said with ATWA and using it to further some other adjenda.

mattprokes said...

how do we know for sure that col.scott is don murphy?
has it ever been proven?
not that it really matters anyway but that rumour has been making the rounds since the late 90s.

katie8753 said...

>>>Matt said: how do we know for sure that col.scott is don murphy?>>>

I don't know Matt. I think he said he was.

But then...I could be wrong. HA HA.

mattprokes said...

i think i remember him denying it many years ago.
but then i could be wrong too.

beauders said...

see most people believe manson was only convicted on conspiracy of murder but he was actually convicted of that as well as seven counts of first degree murder in the tate/labinaca murder trial. it is in the transcripts

katie8753 said...

Beauders, you're right.

According to HS, Manson was convicted of 7 counts of first degree murder, and 1 count of conspiracy to commit murder in the TLB trial.

bradley_nowell_805 said...

ATWA as websites and organizations is fake in my opinion. I'm friend with Michael from Backporch tapes and all of those associated with the Backporch have attempted to be freindly with those trumpeting ATWA. What I've seen from those that scream it the loudest is that they've turned into something that they own. I believe ATWA is a concept. A philosophical thing that exists in the minds of those that are aware of ecology and the environment. So, I guess ATWA is whatever each person wants it to be. ATWA is whatever you can do for the Earth at any given point in time. ATWA is bigger than Manson I think, but they get mixed up. A lot of those that are running those websites and preaching ATWA are really getting away from the whole ideal. They're for the most part, fairly extreme and they shut people off from the idea. ATWA is ATWA and that means that ATWA is basically whatever you want it to be in your own mind.

bradley_nowell_805 said...

The current crop of ATWA folks are very combative and confrontational when people don't do what they want......that's led to a lot of animosity. ATWA is also the whole ONE concept too......that the Earth is ONE thing and that we are all ONE.

katie8753 said...

Hi Bradley. Thanks for taking the time to post your explanation.

>>>The current crop of ATWA folks are very combative and confrontational when people don't do what they want......that's led to a lot of animosity. ATWA is also the whole ONE concept too......that the Earth is ONE thing and that we are all ONE.>>>

What do they want people to do?

I understand that ATWA is a concept of saving the earth. But someone thought of that acronym.

I'm thinking that Sandy and maybe Squeaky started this stuff after Manson was convicted, in order to make him seem "nice".

I also think that it has evolved during the years, depending on who was/is supporting Manson.

I don't know much about his current supporters, but it seems they are "way over the top" as usual, listening to Manson's rhetoric.

The concept of conserving natural resources and protecting the environment is much older than Charles Manson. He certainly didn't invent it.

I guess we're confused about this ATWA business because it always seems to be connected somehow to Manson.

katie8753 said...

>>>Matt said: i think i remember him denying it many years ago.
but then i could be wrong too.>>>

Well you know a lot more about that guy than I do. I just know he says he's a dis-barred attorney and writes a blog. LOL.

bradley_nowell_805 said...

yI think the answer lies in how Manson assimilates knowledge. A lot of people just take stuff in as it is, where as he seems to take stuff and make it his own. I believe ATWA is Charlie's invention which was taken up by Red and Blue. I believe him when he explains that every time he got out of jail the earth was worse off than when he went into jail, at least environmentally. I agree that it has become whatever his friends changed it into. I'm not sure what the current "ATWA people" want done. They're somewhat unorganized. Star is working for both ATWA and a new trial. I think that these two things are not related and get everything confused when put together. I think I answered the questions? lol.....I tried at least. I just kind of watch what's going on as far as Manson/ATWA goes. I believe in the concept of ATWA, maybe just not the application as it is being carried out today. I think it will evolve though......

mattprokes said...

all i remember is that people thought he was a disbarred lawyer then the don murphy thing came up.
the only thing i know of that hes admitted to is having a supermodel wife!
maybe don murphy is a disbarred lawyer with a supermodel wife.
like i said earlier it doesnt really matter just something i've always been curious about.
as for atwa maybe they're not posting because they think they'll be attacked and not taken seriously
but as long as mansons the main person associated with them they will be attacked and not taken seriously.
just look at the mess they(the family) left behind at spahn and barker.....
i posted a link to the mess at barker ranch in another thread but i'm too lazy to look it up again
its in part 3 of the charles manson superstar video part 3 on yt
4 minutes in i think.

katie8753 said...

>>>Bradley said: I'm not sure what the current "ATWA people" want done. They're somewhat unorganized.

Star is working for both ATWA and a new trial.>>>

I think you just answered your own question. LOL.

katie8753 said...

>>>Matt said: as for atwa maybe they're not posting because they think they'll be attacked and not taken seriously
but as long as mansons the main person associated with them they will be attacked and not taken seriously.>>>

HA HA HA HA. Matt you are sooo succinct!!!

The chicken or the egg??

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I don't want to get myself too deep into this ATWA topic (without a shovel, LOL)... because quite frankly... I'm far from an authority on this subject.

I'm not certain who started ATWA... when it was started exactly... or how pure their motives were (i.e., "why" it was started).

But, having said that... I believe Bradley is on the right track.

I think ATWA is essentially a symbol... much like the "peace sign".

If you see the "peace sign" on someone's shirt, it carries a message of sorts... a mindset, a "creedo" if you will.
But the message is not absolutely specific.
I mean... the "peace sign" can have differing meanings to different folks... beyond the obvious mesage of peace... and differing levels of significance to everyone who sees it.
And... the "peace sign" is certainly not an official organization.
(Not that I know of, anyway)

"Go Green"... "Tree Hugger"... it's all similar "buzz words", or "catch phrases".

I think ATWA can be lumped into this message/symbol group... albeit much lesser-recognized by the mainstream.

Trouble is... with the internet... anyone can start a website for little to no money.
That's what I believe has happened with ATWA.
(As Bradley suggested).

Folks jump on the "bandwagon"... or what they perceive as a bandwagon... and all these ATWA sites spring-up.

Trouble is... after these sites open... the operators soon realise... you can't really base an entire website around a "peace sign" sorta speak.

Imagine creating a website around the "peace sign" symbol.
Sure you could create a few fabulous pages from the history and concept of the symbol... but, you'd quickly run out of fodder/subject-matter.

So it is, wth these independent ATWA sites.
They post a collection of Manson/Star photos... a bunch of beautiful photos of trees, animal and water... and then they're soon out of material.

That's pretty much my humble "take" on the subject... which I (admittedly) have very limited knowledge/exposure to.

bobby said...

To me ATWA means: all the way alive.

lol

katie8753 said...

Lynyrd ATWA may be a symbol of something that's important to the environment.

However, as you say, anyone can jump on that and start a website with little or no money, and use it for their own gain.

That's what I think ANYONE who is connected with Manson has done.

The mansondirect.com website is strictly for Manson to continue "wagging his tongue" freely, without having to be interviewed and argued with.

I'm not sure who thought "ATWA" up, but I have a feeling it was Sandy & Squeaky, or in other guise, "Red & Blue".

During the trials, Sandy and Squeaky, along with other minions at the time, threatened to kill the jurors, the judge, the prosecutor, the attorneys, and anyone else connected with this case.

I would like to know how can ANYONE take these idiots seriously?

Anyone of these young people just discovering this case who seriously believe that this ATWA crap is something that Charlie believes in, or invented, needs to review the facts of this case, starting back in 1969!!!

Get your primers out students and start reading!!! HA HA.

katie8753 said...

>>>Bobby said: To me ATWA means: all the way alive.>>>

Yeah Bobby, it's too bad that it didn't mean that for Gary, Steven, Abigail, Sharon, Jay, Voytek, Rosemary, Leno, Shorty and various others that were killed by Manson.

More people than we can imagine.

If anyone doesn't happen to know this: Charles Manson is a killer. Period.

He orchestrated death. Nobody's fault but his.

katie8753 said...

Okay in this clip, Manson reveals his answer to overpopulation:

"In another interview with Geraldo Rivera, Manson goes further, saying that 50 million dead will be required to please mother Earth.

“I’m gonna kill you, as many as I can. I’m gonna pile you up to the sky, I figure about 50 million,” said Manson, “I figure if I can get about 50 million of you I might be able to save my trees and my air and my water and my wildlife.”

Mason characterized the slaughter of 50 million people in the name of saving the planet as “just a drop in the bucket of what’s really coming.”>>>

And then this about Star:

>>>Another of Manson’s “followers,” a 24 year-old woman Manson named “Star,” invoked the Club of Rome’s infamous 1990 publication entitled The First Global Revolution, in which the organization outlined how they would manufacture ecological scares in order to manipulate the public into accepting the imposition of a dictatorial world government run by them, when she talked about Manson’s belief that humans were the enemy of the Earth.>>>

'Nough said???

http://www.infowars.com/charles-manson-global-warming-prophet/

katie8753 said...

Charles Manson is a killer. Always was....always will be. Period.

Why? Because he's mad at society.

Why? Because he blames them for him living in boy's homes and prisons.

Whose fault is that?

HIS!!!!

He could have gotten a job....he didn't.

He could have sought help...he didn't.

He could have called on a relative...he didn't.

He could have realized that his life was a shambles and tried to start over...he didn't.

He has tried to blame everything bad in his life on everyone else but him.

It's mama's fault, it's daddy's fault, it's the government's fault, it's Melcher's fault, it's Wilson's fault, it's the PIG's fault, it's Bugliosi's fault...BUT...it's nobody's fault but Charles Manson's!!!

katie8753 said...

Charles Manson is NOT mentally retarded or otherwise incapable of speaking up.

Far from that. He may be uneducated, but he's far from dumb.

He had plenty of opportunities to speak up and get help.

He didn't. Why? Because he'd rather play the "blame game".

It's easier to play that than blame yourself.

That's why a lot of people are dead.

Because Charles Manson can't take responsibility!!!!

He was, and still is....a loser. And that's by HIS choice!

beauders said...

katie you are ver funny. not only was atwa a p.r. move by manson, i think he also used it keep sandy and lynette busy and in his pocket.

Lynn said...

So how effective is ATWA (for those who believe)....what have they done to help protect the environment? Do they work in conjunction with our government or the EPA? How many trained scientists, geologists, engineers, ep & p folks do they have?

rfoster1 said...

After reading all 115 comments, I find myself in need of some air. I think I'll go sit under my tree, breathe some air, sip some water, and watch the animals do their little animal thing.

This is the one after one fifteen.

Hello Lynyrd. Hello Frank. Hello Katie.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hey RFoster!!!
Long time, no see.

Believe me, I know...

Sometimes Katie "gets on me" for not being "active enough" in the comments section?
Evidently... "I'm not reading all the posts closely enough". LOL
I mean... is she kidding me?
Ever try to responding to 297 posts?! LOL

Blog administration...

It's sometimes like that commercial:
"Wanna get away"?

: )

If you've got fresh air and animals close-by... I say go for it!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

I guess, as my buddy used to say:
"It's a good problem to have"...

whiskybeauty said...

Hi Lynyrd and Katie!
Talking of the swastika, it is also a Hindu symbol, think it represents good luck.

katie8753 said...

Hi Whiskybeauty!

>>>Talking of the swastika, it is also a Hindu symbol, think it represents good luck.>>>

Thanks Whiskybeauty! It's too bad that it was transformed into such a symbol of evil.

Shak El said...

from The Encyclopedia of Religion and Nature by Bron R. Taylor (Editor)
ATWA (an acronym for both ‘’Air, Trees, Water, Animals’’ and ‘’All The Way Alive’’ ) represents the uncompromising ecological mandate propounded by the infamous American convict Charles Manson (b. 11 November 1934) and a number of his most loyal associates. The exact origins of ATWA are obscure, although related ecological beliefs appear to have been present among Manson and his associates during the late 1960′s. After having spent most of his early life behind bars for a string of criminal offenses ranging from auto theft to check fraud, Manson was paroled in 1967 and found a welcoming environment in the burgeoning counterculture. Together with a small retinue of disaffected young people, he took flight from the ‘’madness of the cities’’ and established a communal colony at a ranch in the Santa Susana mountains outside of Los Angeles, California. The group began to make survivalist forays into Death Valley in order to scout out more remote areas of the desert, and in September 1969 some members attempted to thwart nearby road developments by deliberately setting an expensive piece of Earth-moving equipment on fire. This early act of ‘’monkey wrenching’’ – occurring a number of years before the concept would be popularized by Edward Abbey, Dave Foreman, and other radical environmentalists – was a key factor that caused the encampment of Manson associates to come under scrutiny from local law-enforcement authorities. A study of contemporary testimonies reveals that Manson discouraged meat eating while advocating a primal understanding of the natural world which included totemistic identification with various animals. Speaking to Rolling Stone in 1970 after his arrest in connection with the Tate/LaBianca murders, he stated: ‘’Have you ever seen the coyote in the desert? Watching, Tuned in, completely aware. Christ on the cross, the coyote in the desert – it’s the same thing man. The coyote is beautiful … He hears every sound, smells every smell, sees everything that moves. He’s always in a state of total paranoia, and total paranoia is total awareness.” asked what he would do if released, Manson replied: ”I would go out into the desert. The desert is magic … nobody ever wanted me and nobody wants the desert … I’ll live in the desert, like a coyote. I know where every water hole is and every fruit that’s edible … the desert is God’s Kingdom.”

Shak El said...

In the years following Manson’s conviction and imprisonment with a life sentence, his close associates Lynette Fromme and Sandra Good became increasingly active in their efforts to raise awareness of the present systems failure to properly steward the Earth. In what was apparently a desperate attempt to draw attention to this message, Fromme was apprehended after pulling a 1914 military issue .45 handgun on president Gerald Ford in 1975 in Sacramento, California. Shortly afterwords Good was arrested for conspiracy to mail death threats to hundreds of corporate polluters under the aegis of IPCR, or “International People’s Court of Retribution,’’ which may have been a precursor to ATWA. Good served a ten year sentence and was released, while Fromme is currently serving a life sentence (shak el she has been released since this was written).

Shak El said...

By the early 1980′s Manson and his supporters were primarily using the term ATWA, which usually stood for ‘’Air, Trees, Water, Animals,’’ to represent their ecological-spiritual worldview. The name clearly refers to the elements of of the biosphere that are crucial to humans survival; these can also be closely equated to the four cardinal elements in ancient hermetic philosophy: Air, Earth, Water and Fire. ATWA is not represented by any formal organization or membership. In contrast to mainstream environmental groups with bureaucratic structures and tendencies toward compromise, ATWA is a state of radical consciousness, a way of thought and action that seeks to completely redress not just worldwide industrial pollution and ecological imbalance, but also the perceived unnatural evils of media control, consumerism, feminism and matriarchy, overpopulation and racial intermixing. In blunt language, ATWA’s proponents emphasize the unity of life on Earth, which is often spoken of in religious terms. Manson has stated that ‘’Ecology is God, for without it we are dead forever.” This perspective informs both the urgency and the moral fervor of statements such as the following from Sandra Good: ‘’ATWA is your survival on earth. It’s a revolution against pollution. ATWA is ATWAR with pollution — a holy war. You are either working for ATWA — life — or you’re working for death. Fix it and live or run from it and die.” The Representatives of ATWA believe that the devastation of the Earth can only be halted and reversed by a one-world government with the vision and military power to enforce this goal. It is further implied that Manson is one of the few people possessed of the necessary degree of understanding and insight to articulate the course for such solutions. Despite the passage of time, Charles Manson maintains his status in American popular culture as a perennial outsider to the ‘’Establishment’’ and continues to attract interest from new generations of young people. Over the years, aspects of his philosophy have been adopted by radical enterprises ranging from the ultra-left June 2nd movement to revolutionary National Socialists. While Manson’s ideas often reach a wide audience through various websites, music releases, and occasional media interviews, only a few outside of his immediate circle appear to have understood the centrality of ATWA to his worldview.