Thursday, July 18, 2013

Robert Cudak and Joel Rostau

Robert Cudak
Sunset Writes:

There are a number of old news clippings on various sites describing the activities of Robert F. Cudak. I will try to summarize them.  This post may not be 100% accurate as I don't have the time or capability to triple check every microscopic detail.

On June 16, 1971, Cudak was serving 7 years in a Federal Penitentiary.  To avoid further prosecution, he testified before a US Senate committee about an "organized crime" scam he had been involved in.  This scam, involving many people, was to steal bags of registered mail from airports.  Cudak said that if you walked around in an airport wearing the blue ear muffs and brown smocks of the tarmac crew, you could basically do anything you wanted and no one would ask any questions.  What they did was steal bags of registered mail and sell their contents for a period of 2.5 to 3 years from 1967 to 1970.  Cudak estimated the overall take to be around $100 million, Senator Charles H. PERCY said he was "amazed entire trucks were driven from airports without being checked."

These bags of mail contained valuable documents, items, and secret military documents.  Some of the documents were common stock, securities, and treasury notes.  One of the items was diamonds.  Cudak said he once pocketed a 16 carat marquise diamond without his partner noticing.  He said they also filled up a teacup with diamonds on one occasion.  "Cudak, 29, said he came across secret papers on about 20 occasions".  Cudak said he was afraid of the military documents.  One document on air force missiles came from a bag at New York's Kennedy International Airport.  

This loot was then sold to "fences", (receivers of stolen property).  One fence he named, was Joel J. Rostau, 34.  His "bullet ridden" corpse was found in a rental car at Kennedy International Airport in May of 1970.  Rostau had apparently been purchasing securities from the mob-connected theft ring, (I assume for resale).  One of Cudak's partners was James Schaeffer.  He testified that the fences were always affiliated with the mob.

Rostau by no means, was the only person involved in this scam that was murdered.   John B.
Eaton was named as a co-defendant in the stock theft ring case "for his own protection"... he was going to testify for the government.  His body was found one month and one day after Rostau's in a field west of Miami airport, two days after stock conspiracy charges were filed against him.  Joel J. Rostau, 34, Los Angeles, who had been charged with interstate theft of securities from the mail at Kennedy, was found shot to death May 26 in a parked car at that airport.

There were some pretty hardcore mobsters running this ring with Italian and Sicilian sounding names.  $100 million was a lot of money back then.  My "hunch" is that people would kill for it.  Cudak said once: His "mob boss" recommend killing his partner instead of sharing the $125,000 they had just stolen.  

The FBI was investigating the stock theft ring. Rostau had already been charged with the interstate theft of securities.  Some of these people were going to testify against the mob, probably for lesser sentences (I'm guessing). It seems pretty obvious to me, that the mob didn't want people with knowledge of this airport theft ring "fingering" them, that's why Rostau and several others were murdered.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Lynyrd Responds:

I checked each microscopic detail (see newspaper articles below)... and in a word, I agree with Sunset.

Here's the "long and short" of it:
This mafia outfit would steal US mail at airports (primarily John F Kennedy) and "distribute" (ie, sell) the proceeds of those thefts for profit. "Securities"... i.e., stocks and bonds were the main target.  Forty-three million dollars worth of securities, were stolen from Kennedy Airpot alone.

The operation essentially consisted of two crews... the thieves and the "fences".  The thieves of course, would steal the mail... and the fences would unload it (sell it).  Government agents claim this theft and distribution operation was masterminded by the Cosa Nostra, specifically.

At any rate... shit hit the proverbial fan.

Two guys... Robert Cudak and James Schaefer were granted immunity, to testify against their cohorts.  They both executed public confessions... and in the end... they sang like birds.

Joel Rostau and several others were fingered, and awaiting trial.

Before they had a chance to attend trial (and testify)... Joel Rostau, John Eaton and George Wahl were ALL murdered in similar (mafia) fashion.

The police are convinced, that Rostau's death was definitely tied to this airport theft trial.
In fact, the police linked all three deaths (Rostau, Eaton and Wahl) to the airport theft trial.
All three men were "Cudak associates"... personally fingered by Cudak and/or Schaefer.. and about to testify.

This whole situation is, quite frankly, a "real life" version of the movie "Goodfellas".
We have a crime ring that steals from airports... and when shit hits the fan... folks start disappearing.
Rostau is basically one of those guys, who "disappeared".
Like "Carbone" in the movie... Rostau was killed, because the Cosa Nostra didn't want anyone else talking.
(John Eaton and George Wahl were killed for the same reason)

After pouring-over all these newspaper clippings... I must agree with Sunset.
It seems apparent, that Rostau's death, probably had nothing to do with TLB.

The question becomes:
What about Rostau's life?
Did his life have anything to do with TLB?

I will only say this:
It seems these criminals were "up to no good" on several levels.
In fact... several of these guys testified, that they often committed crimes against each other!
Yes... they even stole from each other (among other things).

Rostau reported to police, that $23,000 worth of jewelry had been stolen from his home.

So who knows...?

Did Rostau have another "gig" with drugs?  Sebring?  Frykowski?  Canadians?  Tex?
I have no idea.

But one thing seems fairly certain (from reading all these articles):
Rostau's "mafia-style" murder at Kennedy Airport... probably had nothing to do, with TLB.
Trust me... Rostau had a LOT more going-on at Kennedy Airport, than TLB! LOL
Three guys connected to this mafia theft ring were set to testify... and all three met the same demise.

Peace... LS

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"CLICK" the smaller photos, to expand to full reading size!









"You think Maury tells his wife everything?"

62 comments:

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Thanks for your research Sunset.

I hope folks enjoy this piece, because I worked my ass off on it, for an entire week.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

The related articles were donated by one of our readers, who would like to remain anonymous.

I would like to extend my sincere thanks, to that individual.

Thank You.

katie8753 said...

Thanks Sunset and Lynyrd, for all your research and hard work!

I agree, Rosteau had "bigger fish to fry" than selling drugs to Jay Sebring.

The evidence points to the fact that he was killed for this mail ring theft, and not for TLB.

katie8753 said...

Sorry....Rostau...LOL.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

You just learned the two most important things in life:
Don't ever rat on your friends, and always keep your mouth shut!"

Goodfellas

Brian Davis said...

Sunset is right on it.

We have been all over this since the Schreck interview last year and now it seems a lot of others are starting to look at Rostau more in depth.

But, wait till you connect Sebring to this and it will all come together as the John Lennon sang.

Brian Davis said...

Rosatu was selling drugs to Sebring, imo.

McCaffery was telling the truth, I believe. Thanks.

Brian Davis said...

Hi Katie ! I don't know of anyone that ever claimed Rostau was killed over TLB.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Katie said:
"I agree, Rosteau had "bigger fish to fry" than selling drugs to Jay Sebring".

-----------------------------

Just to be clear, that's not what I said.

What I said was:

The question becomes:
What about Rostau's life?
Did his life have anything to do with TLB?

I will only say this:
It seems these criminals were "up to no good" on several levels.
In fact... several of these guys testified, that they often committed crimes against each other!
Yes... they even stole from each other (among other things).

Rostau reported to police, that $23,000 worth of jewelry had been stolen from his home.

So who knows...?

Did Rostau have another "gig" with drugs? Sebring? Frykowski? Canadians? Tex?
I have no idea.

But one thing seems fairly certain (from reading all these articles):
Rostau's "mafia-style" murder at Kennedy Airport... probably had nothing to do, with TLB.


---------------------------------

So you see... what I said specifically, is that Rostau's death had nothing to do with TLB.
As for what Rostau was involved with (in addition to the airport theft ring)... I said, "I have no idea".

Given his criminal record and behavior... I insinuated that other crime rackets were indeed, a possibility.

Just to be clear.

katie8753 said...

Hi Brian.

My mistake. I was thinking that was the general consensus that Rostau was killed over TLB.

There was a big to-do that Rostau sold drugs to Sebring, and then ended up dead in a trunk.

I must have missed a few paragraphs.

Thanks for clearing that up. :)

katie8753 said...

Lynyrd I agree. Whether Rostau was selling drugs to the yokels at Cielo Drive or not, he was obviously into other things.

More serious things. And that's most likely why he was killed.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Katie said:
"There was a big to-do that Rostau sold drugs to Sebring, and then ended up dead in a trunk.".

It's never been stated outright that Rostau's demise was related to drugs and/or TLB.
But yes... at times... that concept has been implied (by some bloggers).

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Brian said:
"We have been all over this since the Schreck interview last year and now it seems a lot of others are starting to look at Rostau more in depth".

I was receiving information regarding Joel Rostau (from one of my staff), as early as May 11, 2011.
I have the emails to prove it.

I was receiving information regarding Pic Dawson and Frankie Carbo before my blog opened.

Moreover, I've never read Schreck's book and I only caught the first ten minutes of your interview with him, due to other commitments.

Brian Davis said...

Hi again Katie ! No apology needed here.
_____________

To anyone interested, Schreck told me that Lt.Deemer told him that McCaffery told him (Deemer) that she heard one of the guys call the other one "Charles"
in regards to that robbery at Rostau's. I don't know if there was 23k of jewelry taken but Rostau filed an insurance claim for the reported stolen jewelery and was arrested over the robbery because the police found a load of drugs when they got there and guess who his attorney was ? Paul Caruso.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Katie said:
"Lynyrd I agree. Whether Rostau was selling drugs to the yokels at Cielo Drive or not, he was obviously into other things.

More serious things. And that's most likely why he was killed."


------------------------------

We know why Rostau was killed.

As for his involvement with Sebring and/or TLB, my mind is open.

That's about as clearly, as I can state my position.

Brian Davis said...

"The question becomes:
What about Rostau's life?
Did his life have anything to do with TLB?"


Imo, In regards to drug dealing yes.

I truly believe Sebring dealt with Rostau and so did Frykowski but Fry wanted to go more with the Canadians I believe.

Brian Davis said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Brian Davis said...

I was receiving information regarding Joel Rostau (from one of my staff), as early as May 11, 2011.
I have the emails to prove it.


I don't need it proven your word is good to me but since I've been doing the show and before I've never heard or read one blog (including this one) or comment from anyone regarding Rostau.

Maybe a mention in passing but not as serious as since we've brought it out since Schreck.

But hey coincidences happen all the time, just ask all the people that believe in HS, lol

katie8753 said...

Hey guys, I'm gonna hit the hay.

As my mother would say "I'll continyah this tomorrah". LOL.

Night!

Brian Davis said...

Rostau's girlfriend is McCaffery.

McCaffery is Sebring's receptionist/assistant.

Rostau admits to knowing Sebring. (yes Rostau downplayed it..who wouldn't in Rostau's position at that time ?)

Sebring was a coke head.

Rosatu was a coke (among other drugs) dealer.

Is it really that big a leap ? LOL

Brian Davis said...

And I forgot to mention McCafferys comments in the police report. I believe her.

Brian Davis said...

Niters to you Katie !

katie8753 said...

Night! :)

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hi Brian,

In regards to Cielo... if one dismisses "Helter Skelter" as a motive... (in my estimation) we're only left with two viable possibilities:

#1) The drug angle
#2) Charlie simply being a twisted, bitter mofo.

So, believe me... I'm open to anything related to a drug motive.

I've never seen the hard statistics, but I'm sure drugs play a significant role in many (if not most) of our violent crimes nationwide.

And many of those "drug-related" crimes are senseless acts... (and they're NOT carried-out professionally).

Whenever I discuss "drug motive" on this blog... many bloggers immediately conjure images of a professionally orchestrated "hit".

As you know... it doesn't always go down that cleanly.
Look at all the "drive-by shootings" and gang violence our nation has endured, due to drug quarrels.
Those "drive-bys" and gang-related murders are hardly professionally contracted hits.

Cielo may very well, fit that description:
A senseless, unprofessional, non-contracted act of violence, precipitated by drug issues.

sunset77 said...

Thanx for the post Lynyrd. You must have done a great deal of work on it, I started looking into it when I ran across the Robert Cudak testimony.

In the late 1970's I remember reading a "spy" novelist named John Barron, he wrote for The Readers Digest. I'm pretty sure I remember reading at least 1 and probably more stories he wrote about secret military documents being stolen from Kennedy Airport. He blamed it on the Soviet secret police, the KGB. It was the cold war and Barron blamed everything on the KGB. Apparently, it wasn't the KGB, it was Robert Cudak and Joel Rostau and associates that were swiping these documents.

I'm not sure what was in the documents, one clipping said "air force missiles". Cudak said he burned the doucuments or threw them in the water. They could have pertained to thermo-nuclear armed weapons for the defense of Western Europe. In any case, the Soviets would have probably promised an exorbitant amount of money to get their hands on them. They would have never paid the money, they would have done the same thing the mafia did, killed them.

johnnyseattle said...

first off, thank you for the thread Lunyrd and Sunset!

i have never felt that Rastau was killed over TLB. but I have always felt that someone like Rastau was capable of being involved in a multitude of criminal activities.

heck, even in the Sanders book he talks about Rastau getting 'trunked.'


if the same folks who spend a part of each and every day of their life going over this TLB would pony up the 64 bucks you would gain additional insights into what Brian is saying vis a vi the Shreck book. the same author also discusses the fact that the LAPD discovered that the Labianca house was bugged. and Shreck goes farther as to how Rosemary managed to accrue so much money.



what brian points out regarding Paul Caruso is interesting if you follow who his legal partner was and who he represented.

thank you again for the thread.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Brian said:
"I don't need it proven your word is good to me but since I've been doing the show and before I've never heard or read one blog (including this one) or comment from anyone regarding Rostau.

Maybe a mention in passing but not as serious as since we've brought it out since Schreck.

But hey coincidences happen all the time, just ask all the people that believe in HS, lol


---------------------------------

I had compiled a few things on Rostau... but no, I never posted a thread on the topic.
Until recently... I never felt that I had enough material to work with... or quite frankly, that anyone would be interested in discussing him.
I had mostly personal information on the man... and a few weak ties (to TLB).

So, in retrospect, you have a point.
If Rostau wasn't currently being discussed (by others), my materials (and curiosities) would have continued to rot in a cyber-folder forever. LOL

So yeah...
I started digging further into Rostau, because others have been doing the same...

That's a fair assessment.

I really couldn't tell you, who started researching Rostau first.
I know, it wasn't me.
All I can tell you for sure, is that a friend turned me on to the topic a couple years ago... and, I did have a small folder. LOL

'Nuff said... LOL

MrPoirot said...

Rostau knew of Sebring but did not know him.
Rostau knew Frykowski well.
That is what Rostau told police.
There is no reason for Rostau to lie about one acuainceship and tell the truth about the other.

However, Charlene McCaffrey knew Sebring well and knew Rostau well.

MrPoirot said...

By the same token, I have never read that Charlene McCaffrey was friends with Frykowski though I assume she was.

beauders said...

lynyrd can you share anything you have learned about pic dawson or the other Canadian drug dealers?

cooltide martyn said...

Well Well Well.
It was ME who discovered and raised awareness..blah...blah.

If you check out Cats site ,instead of Slagging her off,BD, you will find 8 pages of links to threads, discussions ,newspaper articles and clippings dated back as far as January 2007 all acessed by using "Rostau" in TOTLB'S "search" Function.
Happy Hunting.

Peace

(this will no doubt be ignored and deleted)

Brian Davis said...

Lynyrd,, I'm just glad Rostau and others are being discussed these days now.

________________________________

Mr. P ! Hello ! With respect, Rostau did not say he "knew of him". Rostau said he DID know Jay just not as well as Fry. As I said, Rostau downplayed it.
_______________________________

Cooltide, it just rips you apart doesn't it that Cats isn't the end all for TLB, LMAO !

So Cats has some artcles posted but again, no one over there was actually discussing him. Please stop it.

Cats is bragging about some stupid letter from a whacked attorney that included her website and she thinks she's Ms TLB. And you post " Well Well Well.
It was ME who discovered and raised awareness..blah...blah."


HAHAHAHAHAAH ! How rich !

I never said I discovered Rostau. I simply made an observation in regards to the awareness that has been brought out over the last year of Rostau and McCaffery.

No one seemed interested in Joel Rostau before Schreck came on Cats' TLB Radio Program ( I assume she still thinks she owns my radio show, LOL) and I, JohnnySeattle and a couple others started talking about him after that.

Ok, Ed Sanders.

And really it doesn't matter, I'm just glad these Rostau/McCaffery angles are being discussed period.

Also, if you or Cats wants me to quit "slagging" on her tell her to pull down MY material that she's stolen and in part making money with.



LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hello Cooltide,

Ed Sanders discussed Joel Rostau on March 23, 1975, in an interview conducted by Harold Channer.

That interview, is right here on my blog.
It's been on my blog, for over a year.

Here it is:

http://www.lsb3.com/2012/05/ed-sanders-or-as-starship-likes-to-say.html

So yeah... Mr. Sanders' research (of Joel Rostau) dates all the way back to at least 1975.

I'm ALSO quite sure, that Ed Sanders mentions Rostau in his book... which of course, brings us back to 1971.

So my friend "Cooltide"...
If "CatsCradle", or any other blog author wants to lay claim to "raising awareness" about Joel Rostau... they're full of shit.

Blogs... (and the internet for that matter)... did not become popular until at least 1995... and, that's a very generous estimate.

Ed Sanders researched Rostau... wrote a book on TLB... and participated in an in-depth interview (during which he discussed Rostau)... 25 years before any of us were online!
That's a fact, Jack.

So... 2007, is basically a joke.

I've got better things to do, than sit around debating which "website" shed the most light on Joel Rostau... because quite frankly, it's a stupid f#cking discussion.

If you're going to give credit to anyone, give it to Ed Sanders... OR... whoever informed Sanders (if you can find him/her).

Happy Hunting to you also, Good Sir!

In the future... if you're going to post... please use your real account.

I've never heard of Cooltide Martyn, and I know virtually all the players in this blog game.

Peace!

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

And for the record "Cooltide"...

Your comment was neither ignored OR deleted.

Thanks.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Ten minutes into the Harold Channer Interview, Ed sanders stated:

10:00 -- “The murders uncovered a huge spectrum of things that people wanted to hide. Everything from pornographic movies, to drug dealings, to cultic persuasion as religion…. bad news on all aspects of California life. Desperate people were interested in keeping things hidden”.

Sanders expounds on this topic, explaining how this situation made uncovering facts exceedingly difficult… with lots of dead-ends.

Sanders gives an example, of one such dead-end (paraphrasing):

"I tracked a man for some time… (who supposedly delivered drugs to Cielo)... and that man, was consequently found dead in an automobile trunk".

That "man"... that Sanders was literally "tracking"... of course, was Joel Rostau.

Were any blog or website administrators physically "tracking" Joel Rostau in 1970???!!!
I think not.

Was Nikolas Schreck physically "tracking" Joel Rostau in 1970?
I highly doubt it.

Everyone needs to just chill out.

Brian Davis said...

For my part Lynyrd, my apology. I wasn't trying to lay claim to Rostau, just a bit of observation of the last year or so of the discussion of Rostau around the TLB community seemed to coincide with after Schrecks interview.

I definitely wasn't trying to take anything away from Sunset because that is a great post he and yourself made here.

So again, my apology, I actually am excited to see some serious discussion on Rostau and others not previously discussed in depth, regardless of who brings it out.

And as usual you are right. Any true credit for Rostau goes to Sanders, imo.

Although, I guess you could go further and simply give the credit to the detectives themselves who wrote the police report.

Regardless, it is a very stupid thing to be arguing over so consider myself "chilled".







LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Hi Brian,

No problem.
It's all good.

I'm sure Schreck's interview was a catalyst for renewed interest, in the topic of Rostau.

The truth of the matter, is that ALL the TLB websites and blogs "play off each other".

When a topic is discussed at one location, it usually "makes the rounds" (in one capacity or another).
That's a fact.

As I said earlier:
"If Rostau wasn't currently being discussed (by others), my materials (and curiosities) would have continued to rot in a cyber-folder. I started digging further into Rostau, because others have been doing the same."

We're on the same page.

Bottom line:
I just didn't want this conversation deteriorating into a needless pissing contest.

I jumped-in, because I saw things "going south" quickly, if you know what I mean... LOL

Sunset and I, put a lot of work into this... and it sucks when a thread is derailed with nonsense.

And yes, I'm sure these articles (and many like them) are available for reading elsewhere.
We didn't discover plutonium here.

But what we did do, is compile the information (from several sources) and write a clear synopsis, so folks could easily digest the information... with little effort.
Basically it's a book report.

As someone wrote to me, via email:

"Good stuff! I'm glad you guys wrote it up so that lay persons like me can comprehend!!! I read the same articles on other websites several times and could not connect the dots! I couldn't figure out what role rostau played in the thefts. Great thread Lynyrd!!! Thanks for all your work!"

It's all good.
We're all on the same team.
We all learn from each other, and we all discuss the same topics.
I've learned a lot from your radio show, and your vast array of guests.

I know you didn't come here with the intention of derailing my thread.
I know that.
So... there's no need for an apology.

Peace.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

And with that... I gotta run folks.
Everybody stay cool.

As Tommy Chong's father said, in the movie "Up in Smoke":
"We're not gonna have a family brawl!"

LOLOL

MrPoirot said...

The Rostau aspect of TLB is interesting to me not as a motive but as a way to fill in the picture daily life at Cielo in 69.

Brian's interview of "Patricia" contained an interesting statement. Patricia described Rostau as "the drug guy" at Cielo. I was amazed how quickly and clearly she remembered him.

In that Patricia interview she reveals there was a catty relationship between her(Patricia) and Abigail Folger. Things got so catty between Patricia and Abigail that Patricia had to tell-off Abigail in one flareup. This makes me think Abigail and Patricia shared a lot of time at the pool at Cielo. Patricia must have known Rostau personally. Cielo was a very druggy place it seems. Abigail, Frykowski, Sebring and Rostau made it a druggy place. Rosty seemingly the main drug supplier to Cielo according to Patricia.

Steven Parent had a role in keeping drugs and/or pot flowing at Cielo. He had been to Cielo more than the two times mentioned in Helter Skelter.

I got the impression from Patricia that the druggy crowd succeeded in gaining control of party time at Cielo in 69 to the point that Sharon Tate had to avoid the place. Drugs had crowded her out.

One thinf for sure: nothing good happened around Rostau. That dude was on a bobsled to hell. This maked me think McCaffrey was a no-good herself as well since she was intimate with Rostau.

starship said...

Hercule,

Please stop it with your nonsense.

Things that make me go hmmmmm:

Rostau was found dead in the trunk of a car at JFK Airport, an MO employed by La Cosa Nostra.

The Luchesse family claims to have owned JFK at the time, and they were the ones who pulled off the Lufthansa Heist as seen in GOODFELLAS.

I have heard, but never have been able to confirm, that Gateway Supermarkets were eventually taken over by the same parent company who owns SHOPRITE which has long been rumored to be a LCN controlled company. But which family?

katie8753 said...

Wasn't Rostau some kind of class officer in High School?

I wonder how he went from that to his notorious life of crime.

MrPoirot said...

Starship you use the word nonesensense but never say what you were referring to. I based what I wrote on what Rostau said to police and what Patricia said to Brian on his radio show. It is anything but nonsense.

sunset77 said...

Also, thanx to "anonymous person" for the newspaper clippings. I ran across many and various clippings on at least 5 websites and probably more. This must have been a pretty big news story in the early 1970's.

Re-sizing photo's, watermarking, cropping, etc. is not one of my strong suits, I can barely log onto the internet.

I think Cheech Marin said in the movie "Up In Smoke", "I only know 3 chords". However, Tommy Chong's perspective was a bit different, "You don't have to know anything about music, all you gotta do is be a punk".

Panamint Patty said...

This fucking rules! (please excuse Patty's French). Starship, do you think the Graham Parsons thing is related? Things that make you go, hmmmmm. Might explain why some folks have been so adamant over the years that the mob was involved. While the Mob may not have anything to do with the overall motive, it's fascinating nonetheless.

Panamint Patty said...

PS how close is Brookline to Harvard? Interesting that Joel was from there.

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

Harvard is in Cambridge.

Cambridge and Brookline share a border.
They're right next to each other.

Well, technically... they are separated by the width of the Charles River.
(Cambridge is north of the Charles... and Brookline is south).

They're a quarter mile apart.
(The approximate width of the river).

It's a real heavy-duty thickly settled, inner-city place.

"Cuz, I love that dirty water... oh.. oh... Boston, you're my home". LOL

That song is about the Charles River.
"Down by the banks of the river Charles"... etc...

Home of education and industry... traditionally... Brookline was heavily populated by Jewish people.
That's not quite as true, now.
Yes... Rostau was Jewish.

Peace...

LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...

If you're sitting on the banks of the River Charles in Cambridge... you're looking across at Brookline.

If you're sitting on the banks of the River Charles in Brookline... you're looking across at Cambridge.

LOL!

That's about as graphically, as I can explain it. LOL

Panamint Patty said...

ty, Lynyrd. The closest Patty has ever been to New England is Rochester: the East Coast is a mystery to her.

johnnyseattle said...

"MrPoirot said...
The Rostau aspect of TLB is interesting to me not as a motive but as a way to fill in the picture daily life at Cielo in 69.

Brian's interview of "Patricia" contained an interesting statement. Patricia described Rostau as "the drug guy" at Cielo. I was amazed how quickly and clearly she remembered him.

In that Patricia interview she reveals there was a catty relationship between her(Patricia) and Abigail Folger. Things got so catty between Patricia and Abigail that Patricia had to tell-off Abigail in one flareup. This makes me think Abigail and Patricia shared a lot of time at the pool at Cielo. Patricia must have known Rostau personally. Cielo was a very druggy place it seems. Abigail, Frykowski, Sebring and Rostau made it a druggy place. Rosty seemingly the main drug supplier to Cielo according to Patricia.

Steven Parent had a role in keeping drugs and/or pot flowing at Cielo. He had been to Cielo more than the two times mentioned in Helter Skelter.

I got the impression from Patricia that the druggy crowd succeeded in gaining control of party time at Cielo in 69 to the point that Sharon Tate had to avoid the place. Drugs had crowded her out.

One thinf for sure: nothing good happened around Rostau. That dude was on a bobsled to hell. This maked me think McCaffrey was a no-good herself as well since she was intimate with Rostau.
July 19, 2013 at 1:07 PM"

Mr P., on your comment you and I are close to agreement. Recall when Patricia was asked -out of the blue- about a name from 43 years ago (Joel Rastau)- she pauses for a second or two and then says 'Smokey Joe.' and goes on to say that he brought the drugs to the party. The way she says it (and recall she was tracked down and did not want to be on the show at first) comes off as very genuine.
She also seems to recall Steven Parent as being there more than once and being associated with drugs.
About her run in with Abrigail Folger that comes off as genuine -at least how Patty recalls it.
43 years is a long time ago and you'll be off on dates, etc but you will recall certain events with clarity. Having known a couple of the Cielo Drive murder victims would stick in your casaba...

katie8753 said...

Hi Patty!

To say that Steve Parent was a visitor at the guesthouse more than once is basically calling Bill Garretson a liar.

Of course, that doesn't mean he isn't lying. It just seems odd that he would lie about something like that.

You would think that if Parent was selling drugs at Cielo, there would have been drugs found in his car. I think drug dealers probably have some on hand when trying to sell them.

cooltide martyn said...

Your out of order Lynrd , I did not say that Cats site, TOTLB,was laying claim to anything except that it is an invaluable depository with an exceptional amount of info available to true scholars of TLB and the Watson Murders.
I do not see what the problem is in giving credit where credit is due on occasion.
BD
Cats is not Bragging about anything.
and you are never mentioned in a derogatory or any other fashion @ TOTLB.
YOur posts are still available on the site.

We are all searching for the same thing.....Tarooth!

Peace......and harmony.

Brian Davis said...

Just to be fair, I don't think "Patricia" was lying but I do think she was mixed up a bit.

For example, I'm taking the "Smokey Joe" comment with the proverbial grain of salt because I'm thinking Rostau was more into heavier dealing such as coke, mda, lsd but I don't know how big of a deal pot was back then. And I don't know if Rostau would be dealing with anyone at Cielo except Frykowski and Sebring. I can't see Rostau dealing to Garretson/Patricia/D Kistler.

I know today it seems pot isn't such a big deal in comparison to the other drugs out there.

And I still don't know what to make of her Steven Parent comments.

I think she was confused on some things but not intentionally lying.

I do believe her about her spat(s) with Abigal.

katie8753 said...

Thanks Brian. I've got to listen to that podcast again.

I feel strongly that Garretson wasn't entirely truthful to the cops about what he saw and heard that night. Maybe he was lying about Steve being there. Who knows?

Brian Davis said...

"Katie8753 said...
Wasn't Rostau some kind of class officer in High School?

I wonder how he went from that to his notorious life of crime."


Hi Katie ! I wondered the same thing until I found out he was a mason.

I can somewhat see the progression, for lack of better term, of Rostau getting involved in the "mafia" from there.

Also, the timeline for Rostau is interesting.

He was arrested in San Diego in Fall of 69.

It looks as if he got out of town right after the TLB murders happened and he gave his vague police statements.


katie8753 said...

Thanks Brian. I can imagine that the murders at Cielo Drive shook him up pretty good. I can see why he'd want to get outta Dodge. LOL.

johnnyseattle said...

that 'smokey joe' comment could be that he brought dope with him as well as other drugs.
a lot of folks may only want to partake of the dope and passed on the other stuff.

that she comes up with that off the cuff/reaction tells me that at least in her mind it was true.

doesn't mean he didn't do/bring other things. very well could be that the dope was 'free' and if you wanted other items you had to pay...

i wouldn't get too hung up on the 'literal' meaning of it.

matt prokes said...

Hey Brian,did You ever ask Garretson about 'Patricia'?

johnnyseattle said...

after all, life is like that. one gets a nickname and that kind sticks with you like glue. even if you moved on to other bigger things.




MrPoirot said...

Patricia was about 10 years younger than Abigail so it is interesting that Patricia told off Abigail.

Patricia also contradicts Garretson's story about throwing out Kistler as completely as he says he did. Patricia and Kistler were in a group. Patricia said they went up to Cielo the day of or dsy before the murders. I guess it depends on who "we" is.

Patricia is the only person who ever mentions that Cielo was littered with the heads and tails of dismembered cats.

MrPoirot said...

Dunno why anyone would be surprised that Rostau was jewish and mob connected. The mob was heavily populated with jews. Bugsy Segal was jewish. The scene aound the Family was heavily jewish. I'm surprised Charlie didn't convert to Judaism like Sammy Davis did. More than 20 of the main players around TLB were jewish.

jeffrey jeff said...

Mr. Poirot said:
"Patricia also contradicts Garretson's story about throwing out Kistler as completely as he says he did. Patricia and Kistler were in a group. Patricia said they went up to Cielo the day of or dsy before the murders. I guess it depends on who "we" is."

One of the letters that Billy G was writing the night of the murders was to Darrell Kistler. Billy asking when Kistler was coming back to the Cielo. Tells me it had been a while since they had seen each other.

Great work on this piece Lynyrd and Sunset! Thanks!!

Driving Wheel said...

Heads and tails of cats?? Ritual sacrifice??