tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post8076942520235827292..comments2024-03-19T21:34:44.985-04:00Comments on The Tate-LaBianca Homicide Research Blog: Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger63125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-45344528519903168022011-07-27T10:04:29.059-04:002011-07-27T10:04:29.059-04:00It would be interesting to meet Bugliosi. From my ...It would be interesting to meet Bugliosi. From my (admittedly limited) information, he comes across as rather self-satisfied and has an element of false modesty.However, there's no disputing the fact that the guy is highly intelligent and works pretty damn hard.whiskybeautyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17460114461900962117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-27594775335505619712011-07-14T14:25:59.301-04:002011-07-14T14:25:59.301-04:00Lurch said:
>>>>"Sorry to bum ya ...Lurch said:<br />>>>>"Sorry to bum ya out Jimmy, but I plan on goin to this lil event. Not to worship or kiss the shoes of the Bug, but just to hear what the man has to say.<br />Hope to see ya there Lynn, and thanx for the heads up!"<<<<<br /><br />Great to hear Lurch!<br />Please bring us back some details, and maybe a photo or two?! LOL<br /><br />There's an outside chance Kimchi may attend this event as well.<br />There could be a "3-person contingent" from the blog! LOL<br /><br />I'll let you know, if I hear more from Kimchi.<br /><br />Peace Brother... LynyrdLynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-59720042373098154292011-07-14T14:19:05.635-04:002011-07-14T14:19:05.635-04:00Hi Jim.
As I've said before, you know the cas...Hi Jim.<br /><br />As I've said before, you know the case well, and have many of the facts straight.<br /><br />I agree with you regarding Nader, and Kasabian... (and Atkins to a lesser extent).<br /><br />In regards to HS, I have to go with Saint and Leary on this one.<br />(and you have <i>no idea</i> how monumental THAT statement is!). LOL<br />I didn't think it was possible to agree with both Saint and Leary simultaneously. LOL<br /><br />At any rate, Jim....<br />I agree with most of what you're saying about Helter Skelter.<br /> <br />I believe Bugliosi <i>intentionally</i> excluded several other motives, which he had knowledge of... and <i>intentionally</i> went with HS... 'cuz, he wanted Manson.<br />Bugliosi had no shortage of motives to choose from... but, he purposely went with Helter Skelter specifically (and only), because it best implicated Manson.<br />Dishonest? <br /><i>Probably.</i><br /><br />Here's where we diverge:<br />I don't believe Bugliosi gave Helter Skelter to the "Family".<br />I believe, the "Family" gave Helter Skelter to Bugliosi.<br />And from there... Bugliosi rode it for all it was worth... in the courtroom, and as a cash cow.<br /><br />We agree on all counts.<br />But, I don't believe Bugliosi conjured the HS story out of thin air.<br />It wasn't his own fabrication.<br /><br />In regards to HS:<br /><br />*Did Bug water it, nurture it, and fertilize it? <br /><i>Sure.</i><br /><br />*Did Bug intentionally exclude all other motives, to get Manson? <br /><i>Certainly.</i><br /><br />*Did Bug twist arms, and make deals, along the way (such as Kasabian's), to sell the motive? <br /><i>Definitely.</i><br /><br />*Was Bug aware of several other more logical motives? <br /><i>Sure.</i><br /><br />*Heck... Bugliosi says straight-out, on the Bertice Berry show:<br /><i>"He didn't even think Manson (himself) believed the Helter Skelter non-sense at all".</i>(paraphrasing)<br /><br /><b>BUT...</b> the Helter Skelter story was begun by family members... and Bugliosi, (recognizing it as the "golden ticket" to hang Manson)... utilized it... at the exclusion of all other motives.<br />It's a small detail, but true, none-the-less.<br /><br />As Saint said it best:<br /><i>"bugs didn't pull the term out of a hat and invent the whole thing- that horse was saddled to be rode"...</i><br /><br />Jim... the family saddled that horse, and Bugliosi rode it.<br /><br />Look at it this way:<br />Bugliosi had 8 cards in his hand... all representing possble motives.<br />The "family" dealt him a minth card... with a picture of Manson's head on a platter, with HS, written in the top right corner.<br />Bugliosi immediately got rid of the other eight cards... and went "all in" with the "Manson Trump Card". LOL<br />It's a tough pill to swallow for Manson supporters... but, I really believe, that's the truth.<br /><br />Peace... Lynyrd.LynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-80160520848799805572011-07-14T13:39:08.698-04:002011-07-14T13:39:08.698-04:00I wonder what Manson thought the lyrics to I am th...I wonder what Manson thought the lyrics to I am the Walrus meant?<br /><br />Goo goo g'joob! :)katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-34411668784567919552011-07-14T13:09:11.210-04:002011-07-14T13:09:11.210-04:00H/S in my opinion was NOT the motive for what happ...H/S in my opinion was NOT the motive for what happened..<br /><br />again- just a catch phrase for marketing purposes...<br /><br />attached to a very tragic crime....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-9141018544623167302011-07-14T12:44:03.807-04:002011-07-14T12:44:03.807-04:00Now....that being said....was the true motive of t...Now....that being said....was the true motive of these murders "Helter Skelter"?<br /><br />I don't think so. Bugliosi used it to convict Manson.<br /><br />And...I think that no one on this earth REALLY knows the motive, except for Manson himself.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-25907821848739776492011-07-14T12:42:35.723-04:002011-07-14T12:42:35.723-04:00St. Circumstance, I agree with you.
Charlie is th...St. Circumstance, I agree with you.<br /><br />Charlie is the one who came up with Helter Skelter. The "uprising" that he predicted.<br /><br />He came up with this long BEFORE Bugliosi ever heard of Manson or Helter Skelter.<br /><br />Bugliosi used this "Helter Skelter" as a motive for the crimes.<br /><br />I don't think he embellished it. I think that, according to family members OTHER than Watkins, as well as Watkins, Charlie preached the subject "fanatically" on many occasions.<br /><br />Bugliosi didn't make that term up. The seed of Helter Skelter was already planted in the brains of the family members...by Charlie, long before Bugliosi and BEFORE the murders.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-67089857117116563952011-07-14T12:33:07.125-04:002011-07-14T12:33:07.125-04:00just to bring in the only name missing from this s...just to bring in the only name missing from this smorgasbord today..<br /><br />Even Leary agrees with this logic as you can see from this part of one of his posts on another blog...<br /><br />The two deputies gave depositions on this and it was before Sadie blabbed and before the Bug was even assigned the case, wasn't it? Point being that there is a preponderance of evidence that Manson did believe in a race war. The Bug may have fancied up the facts, but dismissing Charlie's belief in a violent social uprising is not something I can do given all the testimony about it.<br /><br />" The bugs may have fancied up facts"<br /><br />Sort of just what I am saying...<br /><br />So I guess monkey and Leary really aren't the same person after all???<br /><br />So I am NOT always right...<br /><br />hmmmmAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-64333188273073426942011-07-14T12:18:56.544-04:002011-07-14T12:18:56.544-04:00Charlie created the concept as it was come to be k...Charlie created the concept as it was come to be known is a better way to put it- <br /><br />but with help and guidance from Paul Watkins and a few others...<br /><br />along with some visual support...<br /><br />bugs made into the legend it has become today.... for his own agenda<br /><br />can we all agree on this??Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-28214886295054865922011-07-14T12:03:29.495-04:002011-07-14T12:03:29.495-04:00I concur Charlie made it up...
I also concur it w...I concur Charlie made it up...<br /><br />I also concur it was a B/S motive...<br /><br /><br />I just am pointing out- bugs didn't pull the term out of a hat and invent the whole thing- that horse was saddled to be rode...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-74303726995483007182011-07-14T11:08:58.191-04:002011-07-14T11:08:58.191-04:00>>>St said: Bugs did not make Helter Ske...>>>St said: Bugs did not make Helter Skelter up...<br /><br />It was written on walls, doors, and a few members of the family painted this picture for him...>>><br /><br />That's right St. But they all heard it from Charlie first.<br /><br />>>>He may have grown the legend to fit his needs, and the notoriety of the case ( to fit his long term financial gains) but he didn't just pull the phrase out of the air...>>><br /><br />Vincent had to use the Helter Skelter theory to involve Manson. It was simply a way to prove Manson's dominance over some drugged-out hippies. Nothing more, nothing less.<br /><br />Without this incredible "motive" he would probably never have gotten a conviction of Manson.<br /><br />And...as we've discussed "ad nauseum", if Manson had just sat quietly in his chair for 9 months and not shown his domination over the "tribe", even WHILE in jail, he would probably have gotten a slap on the wrist.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-68111417613810347192011-07-14T10:59:51.759-04:002011-07-14T10:59:51.759-04:00Sorry to bum ya out Jimmy, but I plan on goin to t...Sorry to bum ya out Jimmy, but I plan on goin to this lil event. Not to worship or kiss the shoes of the Bug, but just to hear what the man has to say.<br /><br />Hope to see ya there Lynn, and thanx for the heads up!lurchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13117542708565859578noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-18559390555585253822011-07-14T10:58:43.607-04:002011-07-14T10:58:43.607-04:00Bugs did not make Helter Skelter up...
It was wri...Bugs did not make Helter Skelter up...<br /><br />It was written on walls, doors, and a few members of the family painted this picture for him...<br /><br />He may have grown the legend to fit his needs, and the notoriety of the case ( to fit his long term financial gains) but he didn't just pull the phrase out of the air...<br /><br />Paul Watkins probably did more than anyone to make the myth of Helter Sketler...<br /><br />But Bugs did use it for all it was worth....Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-90162277237846830092011-07-14T10:17:47.724-04:002011-07-14T10:17:47.724-04:00>>>Jimmy said: This will PROVE that it w...>>>Jimmy said: This will PROVE that it was Charles Tex Watson and NOT Charles Manson calling the shots when it came to these murders. <br /><br />The Bernard Crow incident, all by itself, shows us that Tex Watson was very much into his own wreckless thing even before the events of August 8th and 9th.>>><br /><br />Who shot Crow??? Manson or Tex??? No one ever said at any time, anywhere to anyone in this case that TEX was in charge of anything but his own ding-a-ling.<br /><br />>>>Salindar Nader is one of the missing links that proves MOTIVE and the MOTIVE, Mr Bugliosi, was not to ignite a race war. The Tate house itself is proof of that because there was only 1 word written on the outside part of the front door and it was only written as an afterthought as the members were walking down the driveway away from the house. NOTHING was written in blood on the inside. NOTHING. Not even after some of the others returned later that night after Manson was told about what happened. The tate house was to be isolated and searched.>>><br /><br />Jimmy we know there was only one word written at Tate, that they had the bolt cutters at Tate, that they had the rope at Tate, that they cut the phone lines at Tate, etc., etc., etc. <br /><br />We've been trying to figure out the WHY to this since it happened. How does the above paragraph (1) involve Bugliosi and (2) solve the mystery of WHY?<br /><br />I think we all pretty much agree that "Helter Skelter" was some bullshit Charlie made up to keep his minions in line. But they were his minions and they did what he said. We've established that.<br /><br />We just need to know WHY?katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-64287960719526179212011-07-14T10:10:19.098-04:002011-07-14T10:10:19.098-04:00Jimmy, who's been picking your brain boy? You...Jimmy, who's been picking your brain boy? You need to come back to the light.<br /><br />>>>>....but i also know that Vince did whatever he possibly could to pin this thing on Manson and even went so far as to allow Susan Atkins to give grand jury testimony at at time when she was clearly not mentally competant to do so.>>><br /><br />"Pinning this thing on Manson" was the only logical thing to do, since Manson was the reason it happened. Susan was perfectly capable of testifying to the grand jury. The only problem with that was that Susan was still controlled by Manson and he was able to bully her down.<br /><br />>>>It's a known fact that Vince was going around threatening various Manson Family members in order to get them to testify to what he wanted them to testify too. One such case was that of Catherine Share and i believe that even Catherine had publicly confirmed this in an interview that she did with the BBC.>>><br /><br />You can call it "threatening" but in reality, it was the usual DA's tactic to get people to testify against the "leader" by offering them immunity for lesser charges, which is what he did. Nothing at all wrong with that. <br /><br />>>>Vincent Bugliosi, as Charles Manson himself once told a reporter by the name of Ben Horin, was basically given permission to break the law to secure a conviction and I believe that's exactly what he did.>>><br /><br />"As Charles Manson himself once told a reporter"? That speaks volumes. Rule #1: don't believe anything Manson says.<br /><br />>>>I want Vincent Bugliosi himself to tell me why Linda Kasabian, who was in the car enroute to the LaBianca residence only a day after the Tate murders went down, did not participate in that event.>>><br /><br />How would he know?<br /><br />>>>Linda Kasabian was not outside standing guard at the Tate residence as Vince has always claimed.>>><br /><br />Linda is the one who said that, not Vincent.<br /><br />>>>Linda Kasabian was not selected to participate in LaBianca because there was another destination on the agenda that evening and which was also why extra people were brought. Labianca had to happen FIRST.>>><br /><br />Okay....so how is this Vincent's fault?<br /><br />>>>He won't talk about Salindar Nader or even admit that Nader and LaBianca were time-linked events, but yet they were.>>><br /><br />I know that you think the "proposed" Salindar murder is the "key" to this whole case, but in reality, it's a very insignificant piece of this puzzle. So some actor didn't get offed. How is this non-event crucial in determining the reason for these murders?katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-43312169308624816672011-07-14T07:58:02.188-04:002011-07-14T07:58:02.188-04:00Watch casey anthony. She walked. Watch oj and robe...Watch casey anthony. She walked. Watch oj and robert blake. They walked too.<br />Charlie and clan will never walk.<br />Bug sacrificed his personal life to send them up.let's be glad we had a Bug. I don't want them out. I'm sorry they weren't executed.MrPoirothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06155552886069024565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-38430494210829021622011-07-14T06:39:31.708-04:002011-07-14T06:39:31.708-04:00Vincent Bugliosi is no different than John Waters....Vincent Bugliosi is no different than John Waters. They'll both sell your soul for a nickel and they're both disgusting human beings.<br /><br />You're a gentleman Lynyrd. Don't lower yourself to cater to people who are not deserving of it.<br /><br />Good day Folks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-61480451627673364852011-07-14T06:38:54.943-04:002011-07-14T06:38:54.943-04:00LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...
>>>
With all d...LynyrdSkynyrdBand said...<br /><br />>>><br />With all due respect Jim... you're over-reacting a bit.<<<<br /><br />As with the mission statement of ColScott, I want to know the Truth and I know that Bugliosi is lying and, more impotantly, he knows it too.<br /><br /><br />>>>Like him, or hate him... Bugliosi is a huge part of this case. He was actually AT the entire trial, which is more than any of us can say... and, moreover... he's part of history.<<<<br /><br />Yes he was, but i also know that Vince did whatever he possibly could to pin this thing on Manson and even went so far as to allow Susan Atkins to give grand jury testimony at at time when she was clearly not mentally competant to do so. <br /><br /><br />>>><br />You can liken Bug to a criminal (if you want)... that's your prerogative... it really doesn't matter to me (I'm not Bug's mother)... but like it or not, the man IS part of American history, and always will be.<<<<br /><br />Vincent Bugliosi IS a criminal and he was permitted to write his own version of history which he called "Helter Skelter".<br /><br />It's a known fact that Vince was going around threatening various Manson Family members in order to get them to testify to what he wanted them to testify too. One such case was that of Catherine Share and i believe that even Catherine had publicly confirmed this in an interview that she did with the BBC.<br /><br />Vincent Bugliosi, as Charles Manson himself once told a reporter by the name of Ben Horin, was basically given permission to break the law to secure a conviction and I believe that's exactly what he did.<br /><br />It appauls me, that even to this day, NOBODY has confronted Vincent Bugliosi and challenged him about the validity of his so-called "Helter Skelter" theory.<br /><br />I want Vincent Bugliosi himself to tell me why Linda Kasabian, who was in the car enroute to the LaBianca residence only a day after the Tate murders went down, did not participate in that event.<br /><br />Linda Kasabian was not outside standing guard at the Tate residence as Vince has always claimed.<br /><br />Linda Kasabian was not selected to participate in LaBianca because there was another destination on the agenda that evening and which was also why extra people were brought. Labianca had to happen FIRST.<br /><br />Vince will NEVER admit that. He won't talk about Salindar Nader or even admit that Nader and LaBianca were time-linked events, but yet they were.<br /><br />You let me at Vincent Bugliosi and i'll get you the truth. He won't dodge me. I'm not Larry King and I'm not Maury Povich.<br /><br />I'm calling out Vincent Bugliosi because he's a LIAR.<br /><br />Linda Kasabian herself, with the Tate and Nader events defines her role in things, but both Bugliosi and Steven Kay have thrown dirt on the Nader incident like it was something that never happened when it did.<br /><br />This will PROVE that it was Charles Tex Watson and NOT Charles Manson calling the shots when it came to these murders. <br /><br />The Bernard Crow incident, all by itself, shows us that Tex Watson was very much into his own wreckless thing even before the events of August 8th and 9th.<br /><br />Salindar Nader is one of the missing links that proves MOTIVE and the MOTIVE, Mr Bugliosi, was not to ignite a race war. The Tate house itself is proof of that because there was only 1 word written on the outside part of the front door and it was only written as an afterthought as the members were walking down the driveway away from the house. NOTHING was written in blood on the inside. NOTHING. Not even after some of the others returned later that night after Manson was told about what happened. The tate house was to be isolated and searched.<br /><br />No Lynyrd, Bugliosi IS the enemy and it's because he has lied and has written a FALSE history that has forever left its mark on our social conscience.<br /><br />For that, Vincent T. Bugliosi, I hereby find you *GUILTY* as charged.<br /><br />I wasn't angry at you Lynyrd - I just got annoyed when i saw you kneeling down to polish the shoes of Vincent T. Bugliosi.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-14730582188621654892011-07-14T02:41:19.315-04:002011-07-14T02:41:19.315-04:00Saint said:
>>>>"back into semi r...Saint said:<br />>>>>"back into semi retirement"<<<<<br /><br />LOLOL<br /><br />Saint, you're still the King of the one-liners! hahahaLynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-47239677997697699752011-07-14T02:36:00.098-04:002011-07-14T02:36:00.098-04:00BTW... Hello to Saint, Marliese, Stella and MattP!...BTW... Hello to Saint, Marliese, Stella and MattP!!<br /><br />I generally try to say hello, or at least, acknowledge everyone's comments in some capacity, but, it's been a busy day.<br /><br />Peace... LynyrdLynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-81955320260639944592011-07-14T01:05:50.080-04:002011-07-14T01:05:50.080-04:00No... it's good you explained it. LOLOL
Lana....No... it's good you explained it. LOLOL<br /><br />Lana... I said Lara.<br /><br />Oh well... I was off by only one letter... not bad for just reading the name once, a couple threads back. : )LynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-35752333756934327722011-07-14T01:00:42.300-04:002011-07-14T01:00:42.300-04:00Lana Kane, she'll ease your pain.
(You know,...Lana Kane, she'll ease your pain. <br /><br />(You know, like the stuff for burns? Lanacaine, or whatever?)<br /><br />Oh no, it ruins the joke when you explain it, right?<br />Oh well...8/9 babyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12121677564843056444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-64960845861852882602011-07-14T00:46:39.585-04:002011-07-14T00:46:39.585-04:00What is it?
"Secret Sexy Agent Lara" or ...What is it?<br />"Secret Sexy Agent Lara" or something? LOLLynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04603696815079837528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-59730239593922717542011-07-14T00:44:17.291-04:002011-07-14T00:44:17.291-04:00LynyrdSkynyrdBand said:
"Sorry 8/9 Baby.
Tha...LynyrdSkynyrdBand said:<br />"Sorry 8/9 Baby.<br /><br />That wasn't all directed at you.<br /><br />I'm finally on a computer, with enough time, to address this whole discussion.<br /><br />I was just "thinking aloud". "<br /><br /><br />Nothin but love, L/S, no worries.<br />But if you do step out of line, i w i l l give you a whoopin! :)8/9 babyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12121677564843056444noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-18710051640227649572011-07-13T22:40:00.984-04:002011-07-13T22:40:00.984-04:00Kalo Kaelin. Remember that guy???
He survived ...Kalo Kaelin. Remember that guy??? <br /><br />He survived the OJ trial, as arduous as it was and is living well in Las Vegas (whatever that means LOL).katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.com