tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post5983029346129640936..comments2024-03-19T21:34:44.985-04:00Comments on The Tate-LaBianca Homicide Research Blog: William writes... regarding Ed Sanders' bookUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger63125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-6636598028959805862019-03-15T00:37:45.277-04:002019-03-15T00:37:45.277-04:00Yes my niece is very lucky, there are not a lot of...Yes my niece is very lucky, there are not a lot of happy endings in life.beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-2664424084275197442019-03-14T21:12:18.070-04:002019-03-14T21:12:18.070-04:00Thanks Beauders. That's a heart warming story...Thanks Beauders. That's a heart warming story. I wish everything could end happily. But sometimes it doesn't.<br /><br />But it's nice to hear that sometimes it does.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-54498549906948669612019-03-14T21:09:10.303-04:002019-03-14T21:09:10.303-04:00I agree Katie that Atkins was ruined but I have a ...I agree Katie that Atkins was ruined but I have a niece who was in a similar situation. She was a foster child my brother and his wife brought into their lives and adopted when she was three. We later learned she had been sexually abused and was taught some bad habits such as shop lifting. When Kristin was twelve my brother died. Her adoptive mother provided her a home and food but not a lot of love or attention. It was so bad that she moved in with my sister and her family for a year. It was a 750 mile move but it was worth it. Today my niece is married with two children. Her husband is a great guy who loves her and their children. They are a little older than thirty and just bought their first house in the Bay Area, which is quite a feat for anyone there. They are an ambitious, family orientated couple. Thank goodness Kristen didn't take Atkins road. Kristen's biological people were drug users so she has the addictive gene in her biology too. Her children have even healed the rift between my niece and her adoptive mother, she is a great grandmother.beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-17165812616662160882019-03-13T22:42:36.896-04:002019-03-13T22:42:36.896-04:00Thanks Beauders.
For what it's worth, I think...Thanks Beauders.<br /><br />For what it's worth, I think that Susan Atkins was "ruined" in her teen years because her mother died and her Daddy took a powder, and she was left to fend for herself. I think she did whatever she thought would "shock" folks, which made her feel better as a person because she was so damaged. I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I feel sorry for Susan because that all happened to her. But it didn't give her license to kill.<br /><br />Having said all that, this is NOT the Susan Atkins blog.<br /><br />And the time change says I should go to bed.<br /><br />Night y'all!katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-85407968954400101352019-03-13T22:28:38.803-04:002019-03-13T22:28:38.803-04:00Atkins having lesbian experiences is not the defin...Atkins having lesbian experiences is not the defining act of her life, we all know what that was. Falling for a dead woman seems pretty strange but people do what people do. Read Gilmore’s book it might answer some of your questions. beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-88290163866190449182019-03-13T22:25:08.267-04:002019-03-13T22:25:08.267-04:00It’s been a long time since I read the Gilmore boo...It’s been a long time since I read the Gilmore book. I don’t remember the woman’s name. Obviously Atkins was not a lesbian. A lot of women experiment in their teens and twenties. This is what I believe Atkins was doing. beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-58114344822935426332019-03-13T21:38:14.675-04:002019-03-13T21:38:14.675-04:00Beauders, I posted this comment from Chris. It...Beauders, I posted this comment from Chris. It's up to you whether or not you want to answer it. I told him to tone it down and just have a civil conversation. Which he has done, as much as he can.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-91283609887843248782019-03-13T20:03:08.950-04:002019-03-13T20:03:08.950-04:00Beauders, John Gilmore is a liar. He said she had ...Beauders, John Gilmore is a liar. He said she had a girlfriend but literally all other reports have it that she was staying at a house with a bunch of people when one day Manson came in and played guitar and her and him spoke to each other the same day. It also has it that the house was raided later on leaving her homeless and Manson invited her to come travel with him and the Family. So she left her MAN and went with them. Gilmore seems to be the only one saying She had a girlfriend. Where exactly does he get this from? Is it from Susan or the Family themselves? From interview, news, and trial transcripts? Newspapers? Did someone contact him and tell him that they were Susan's girlfriend? Please answer. Also do any other books mention this? Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-40482265935042412572019-03-13T14:43:29.649-04:002019-03-13T14:43:29.649-04:00katie8753 said...
William do you think that Manson...katie8753 said...<br />William do you think that Manson really knew that much about Sharon? Did he ever mention her by name prior to the Cielo Drive killings?<br /><br /><br />I cannot refer to any source that says that Manson knew Sharon Tate by name prior to the killings. <br /><br />Manson would have learned much about her and her marriage with Roman Polanski from reading the newspapers. He also visited the Cielo Drive residence twice on the same day in March 1969, claiming he wanted to find Terry Melcher, but since he was having meetings with Melcher during this time, it is hard to believe that he did not know that Melcher had moved out the previous month. Sanders said the visit is “still mysterious.”<br /><br />He also could have gained a lot of information from circulating among the children and relatives of entertainment personalities. His association with Dennis Wilson is well known. <br /><br />According to Terry Mauro’s book The Ultimate Evil, Robert deGrimston, founder of a satanic group called the Process, met Manson in the spring of 1968 at a residence in Topanga Canyon. deGrimston traveled in a social milieu that included Sharon Tate, John and Michelle Phillips, Jay Sebring, Warren Beatty, Jack Nicholson, Jane Fonda, Peter Sellers, Wojiciech Frykowski, and Abigail Folger.<br /><br />The Process that deGrimston founded combined Satanism with white supremacist ideology. According to Bugliosi, p. 613, members of the Process had a “natural hatred for the Negro.”<br /><br />I believe that the decision-making for Helter Skelter came not from a single individual like Manson but rather it came from a group. Manson would have been part of this group, and of course a key player, but his knowledge of who Sharon Tate was as a person prior to the killings was not a necessary component in the plan by the group to kill her and blame it on the blacks.William Westonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10569199741225116792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-12057195666544901792019-03-13T14:24:03.718-04:002019-03-13T14:24:03.718-04:00I don't hate her I'm just saying I won'...I don't hate her I'm just saying I won't and can't support an LGBT person. I was just wanting Beauders to tell me what Gilmore says specifically and if any other books say she had a girlfriend. Where did Gilmore get this information from? Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-43974356210595286042019-03-13T10:08:19.174-04:002019-03-13T10:08:19.174-04:00Thanks Beauders.
Chris I'm not going to post ...Thanks Beauders.<br /><br />Chris I'm not going to post your last comment. It's just 5000 words or less about how you now hate Susan Atkins. If you want to re-write it and join in an intelligent conversation, feel free.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-40823605233460540802019-03-12T23:45:25.131-04:002019-03-12T23:45:25.131-04:00Chris read Gilmore’s book it paints a very interes...Chris read Gilmore’s book it paints a very interesting picture. I learned a lot about Beausoleil from that book. It’s available on Amazon and is an old book so you could probably find it at the library. Sleep well Katie.beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-35574264381021549432019-03-12T23:24:14.563-04:002019-03-12T23:24:14.563-04:00Okay I'm going to bed. This time change is ki...Okay I'm going to bed. This time change is killing me. <br /><br />We'll take this up in the morning. Night y'all!katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-10010442014384379552019-03-12T23:13:16.730-04:002019-03-12T23:13:16.730-04:00What was the girl's name? Is that true? Did Su...What was the girl's name? Is that true? Did Susan really do that stuff? Is Gilmore reliable and known for accuracy? Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-51842378851482235422019-03-12T22:33:59.139-04:002019-03-12T22:33:59.139-04:00Chris, according to John Gilmore in, "Garbag...Chris, according to John Gilmore in, "Garbage People," Susan Atkins had a girlfriend she was having sex with when she met Manson.beaudershttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14223387983663922713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-2617577948032399382019-03-12T16:19:33.740-04:002019-03-12T16:19:33.740-04:00William do you think that Manson really knew that ...William do you think that Manson really knew that much about Sharon? Did he ever mention her by name prior to the Cielo Drive killings?katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-61665274289177250722019-03-12T15:19:08.441-04:002019-03-12T15:19:08.441-04:00Susan Atkins didn't do any lesbian stuff. She ...Susan Atkins didn't do any lesbian stuff. She was straight. That lesbian stuff was lies. Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-3152643419349248932019-03-12T14:06:48.100-04:002019-03-12T14:06:48.100-04:00Torque said …
Finally, if Sharon was the last to d...Torque said …<br />Finally, if Sharon was the last to die because "she had to watch," exactly how was it that she had to watch the others die? And why?<br /><br />Sharon Tate would not have seen the final death blows of Frykowski and Folger. Perhaps the original intent was for her to see all of them die before she was killed, but their escape from the living room prevented that from happening.<br /><br />The killers thought they had killed Sharon and Jay, but they somehow survived and moved to the front porch. Thus when Manson and his partner arrived on the scene, they moved them back into the living room. Susan Atkins must have learned later that Sharon was the last to die from Manson. That would mean that Manson and his partner had forced Sharon to watch them give the final death blows to Jay before killing her. They probably did this to increase the cruelty of her own death. Why? Because she was a blonde Nordic-looking woman who had married a Jew. I believe Sebring, whom Sharon dated, also had a Jewish background.<br /><br />Manson was a white supremacist who told his followers that “Hitler had the best answer to everything” and that he was “a tuned-in guy who leveled the karma of the Jews.” As an admirer of Hitler, Manson would of course find mixed marriages especially abhorrent.<br /><br />The whole Helter Skelter operation was conceived and executed by a violent faction within an ultraright, white supremacist group.William Westonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10569199741225116792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-6549975902945471262019-03-12T09:53:37.176-04:002019-03-12T09:53:37.176-04:00Chris I posted the above comment. I'm not goi...Chris I posted the above comment. I'm not going to post the 2nd comment you are trying to make. It's just more of the same except much longer & seedier. <br /><br />Keep in mind that YOU are the reason the comment moderation is on. If you want to post comments that aren't offensive to anyone who replies to your question, then there shouldn't be any problem.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-24509586431078179162019-03-12T05:18:37.613-04:002019-03-12T05:18:37.613-04:00Please let this post go through. I'm having tr...Please let this post go through. I'm having trouble comprehending something. Allegedly the Family practiced homosexuality. But in prison Howard and Graham were hitting on Atkins and She started telling them a bunch of crazy shit about the murders and stuff. And while in prison Pat and Leslie became full fledged lesbians but Susan didn't because She said it was against Her religion. Did Susan ever have sex with a girl or not or did some girls partake in LGBT sex but others didn't? Was it a lie that the Family did LGBT stuff? I really really need to know. Katie, Grim, anyone really. Please answer. I know Howard said some questionable things about Susan in her interview with McGann and Patchett but Howard and Graham also "spiced it up a bit" AKA made shit up. Was Susan bi? Did Susan ever have sex with another girl? Please answer. I really need to know. Please. I'm not trolling or anything I swear to God I'm just seriously wanting to know cause I'm reconsidering some things. And please cite your source. Bill Nelson and Ed Sanders aren't reliable so don't cite them. What I'm really asking is this: Did Susan Atkins ever have sex with, make out with, or flirt with a girl? I know She had a fling with a male prison guard in 1973. Please Katie let this post go through. Please. Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-59045335033981511612019-03-11T15:58:36.302-04:002019-03-11T15:58:36.302-04:00According to Bugliosi in his book Helter Skelter, ...According to Bugliosi in his book Helter Skelter, copyright 1994 p. 269, the Longhorn revolver, when found, had two live rounds and seven empty shells. Originally coroner Noguchi said that Frykowski had been shot one time, Sebring one time, and Parent five times. Seven shots matched seven empty shells. Yet Susan Atkins said that Parent had been shot four times. So Bugliosi had Noguchi examine photographs of Parent’s body until he found that two wounds in the body were created by one bullet, thus making four shots fired. That left one shot unaccounted for. So Bugliosi had Noguchi examine photographs of Frykowski’s body, at which time he detected a second wound in the thigh.<br /><br />I bring this up because a security officer for Bel Air Patrol, Robert Bullington said he heard three shots spaced several seconds apart, at approximately 4:00 am. This was the period of time when Manson and his partner would have been at the house.<br /><br />This brings me to a theory I have.<br /><br />Tex shot Frykowski twice with the Longhorn revolver – in addition to beating him on the head with the gun and stabbing him with a knife. When Manson and his partner came to the house, they saw Frykowski lying on the ground. Not sure if he was really dead, one of them fired a round into the body to test whether or not he had a response. This gun was not the Longhorn that Tex had. A test round might also have been fired into the bodies of Parent and Folger as well. If Noguchi missed in his physical examination (the best evidence) the true disposition of the bullet wounds in Frykowski and Parent (and possibly Folger), it is quite possible that he made further errors in his examination of the photographs (secondary evidence).<br /><br />Thus Bullington could have been entirely correct when he said he heard three shots spaced several seconds apart at 4:00 am.William Westonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10569199741225116792noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-33001051935605681822019-03-11T11:22:40.870-04:002019-03-11T11:22:40.870-04:00Only if you keep it clean.Only if you keep it clean.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-28057659282444601352019-03-11T09:36:23.601-04:002019-03-11T09:36:23.601-04:00Is it safe to post here again? Is it safe to post here again? Chris Hannelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05039199576081872642noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-57576106734869160762019-03-10T16:22:53.275-04:002019-03-10T16:22:53.275-04:00katie8753 said...
Boy that Grim doesn't r... katie8753 said...<br /><br /> <b>Boy that Grim doesn't run outta words, does he? HA HA!</b><br /><br />He would if this was an Egyptian or Slovakian blog !grimtravellerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00025774296829848608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-4569845684559626802019-03-07T21:47:41.523-05:002019-03-07T21:47:41.523-05:00William Weston said...
I am having trouble findin...William Weston said...<br /><br /><b>I am having trouble finding out where the bullet hit Sebring. Can you tell us where it hit him?</b><br /><br />According to coroner Noguchi, <i>"the gunshot wound was found in the left axilla, inside the armpit, and this was found slightly in front of the midline of the left side of the chest. The wound tract penetrated downward, penetrated to the left fifth rib and penetrated through the left lung."</i><br /><br /><b>Stab Wounds Don’t Always Kill </b><br /><br />That's true. The article is bang on the money, there are so many variations of the different kinds of wounds. But once again, while technically <i>possible</i>, you have to consider the circumstances facing the victims and the likelihood that a pregnant woman, unused to that level of physical violence could feign death with 11 stab wounds that have, in some cases, punctured {though not unto death} lungs etc.<br />Another point that occurs to me is this; there is no possible way that Susan could have known that Sharon was stabbed in the chest, around the heart unless she'd been there. And they are essentially the wounds that were fatal. That, more than anything else tells me Sharon did not feign death and then was finished off hours later by Charlie and your mystery assailant. It's comparable to what sunk Leslie Van Houten ~ her statement to Dianne Lake that she'd stabbed a body that was already dead. Why that was so devastating is that it was medically possible to determine if the body was stabbed after death had occurred. By hitting on something so unusual, it proved beyond any reasonable doubt that she'd been there. Susan got the area of death 100% accurate ~ something she couldn't have done without actually knowing it.<br /><br /><b>If Bryan Hartnell could fool someone as experienced as the Zodiac Killer, someone else could fool an amateur like Tex</b><br /><br />Did the Zodiac attempt to make sure Hartnell was actually dead ? Kicking him in the face, whacking him in the face, further stabbing once he lay on the ground ? <br />Tex may have been an amateur but he was pretty thorough. When someone is feigning death, they're not prepared for surprise moves.<br /><br />katie8753 said...<br /><br /> <b>none of this stuff can ever be proven. It's all theories, because the killers have never told the whole truth</b><br /><br />That's only true up to a point though.<br />Leslie wasn't lying when she said she'd stabbed a dead body. It's just that she didn't know that the body had also been alive when she started stabbing.<br />Even if the perps haven't told the entire story {it may never have been possible for them to}, that doesn't mean a case could be made to absolve, say, Pat and Tex. No direct evidence proves they did anything. So we then <i>have</i> to take the words of Susan and Linda. When Linda tells that Pat moaned about her hand hurting because she kept hitting bones as she stabbed, and then the coroner testifies that bones showed signs of having been penetrated, then that is <i>proof</i>. <br />What will always be conjecture on our part is something like why Sharon had defensive wounds on her arms or rope abrasions of the type consistent with hanging on her cheek. But again, these don't alter what happened and who was guilty of the crimes.grimtravellerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00025774296829848608noreply@blogger.com