tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post5164738803985375669..comments2024-03-19T21:34:44.985-04:00Comments on The Tate-LaBianca Homicide Research Blog: Vincent Bugliosi, Best Known for Prosecuting Charles Manson DiesUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger79125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-43122131834735832852015-06-19T20:04:34.994-04:002015-06-19T20:04:34.994-04:00Thanks Grim! Charlie always minimizes his involve...Thanks Grim! Charlie always minimizes his involvement in these murders. That's the problem....katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-76471450246612229142015-06-19T18:39:40.704-04:002015-06-19T18:39:40.704-04:00Nobody said...
"Based on what I've seen,...Nobody said...<br /><br />"Based on what I've seen, he was complicit in the Shea and Hinman cases"<br /><br /><br />Complicit ? In George Stimson's recent book, he admits to being involved in both of these though he kind of minimizes his impact and makes it seem that the victims were basically to blame for their own demise, even going so far as to say about Gary Hinman that "Hinman killed Hinman, that's what it comes down to."<br />He goes into detail about whacking Hinman with the sword and this is his undoing. If you read the August 8th Hinman autopsy, that sword slice is described as "possibly fatal."<br />That's huge. That's complicit.<br />grimtravellerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00025774296829848608noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-13227063944373448872015-06-16T21:53:24.902-04:002015-06-16T21:53:24.902-04:00Thanks Stormy. But you're wasting your time. ...Thanks Stormy. But you're wasting your time. Nobody wasn't interested in that, he was only trying to cause trouble on this blog, but I stopped him. Believe me...I know.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-16615660140403899312015-06-16T16:13:46.015-04:002015-06-16T16:13:46.015-04:00If Nobody genuinely wants to know the evidence pre...If Nobody genuinely wants to know the evidence presented that convicted Manson, he or she can read Bugliosi's summation in the trial: http://law2.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/manson/mansonsummation.html<br /><br />Also, it should be kept in mind that it was not simply one jury that has kept Manson locked up all these years. He and his gang have had 45 years to convince various parole boards, judges, and anyone else of their innocence. They have had nearly a half century to convince someone to give them a new trial. <br /><br />To date the main 6 (now minus Atkins) have all failed. Mrstormsurgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08979442670384492209noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-57524525421763123742015-06-16T13:57:44.876-04:002015-06-16T13:57:44.876-04:00If I have some free time later in the week (and I&...If I have some free time later in the week (<i>and I'm in the mood</i>), I'll answer "Nobody's" question.<br /><br />However, I have no intention of re-trying the entire case.<br /><br />In order to fully answer "Nobody's" question, one would have to recount every pertinent detail of the case.<br />Because, for fuck's sake, it's the many "pertinent details" that convicted Manson!<br /><br />The bottom line:<br />When people come into these rooms, they're expected to have a rudimentary understanding of this case, it's inherent details, and how those details led to the outcome.<br />I can't go back and explain the entire case against Manson, in the comments section.<br /><br />If someone wants to learn the entire case against Manson, they'd have to go back and read every fucking thread on this blog.<br /><br />The case against Manson has already been presented and documented... and now, you're either convinced by the supporting evidence (like the jury was), or you're not.LynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14729740027224198169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-78938289846698419262015-06-16T13:56:01.761-04:002015-06-16T13:56:01.761-04:00I'm not sure what he wanted. First he wanted p...I'm not sure what he wanted. First he wanted proof that Manson was guilty, and we all went over that with him, then he just kept saying "Go back and read my comments", like we were all idiots. Then he started contradicting himself.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-88640247917098327542015-06-16T13:53:06.346-04:002015-06-16T13:53:06.346-04:00Currently, there are no comments awaiting approval...Currently, there are no comments awaiting approval (from "Nobody"), and there hasnt been, for over 24 hours.<br /><br />I can't "approve" comments that don't exist, so I'm not quite sure what Katie is referring to.<br /><br />It seems "Nobody" is looking for an in-depth answer. (i.e., the kind of answer which requires considerable time and effort).<br /><br />I was considering investing my own personal time, to answer "Nobody's" question (at my own convenience), but it seems he/she is gone, so I'm not gonna waste my breath. <br /><br />Contrary to Katie's belief, this blog is not intentionally designed with any predetermined slant.<br />I really don't care which side of the fence someone is on.LynyrdSkynyrdBandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14729740027224198169noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-14776490399359181282015-06-16T12:16:40.352-04:002015-06-16T12:16:40.352-04:00Well if somebody asks me to prove the Sun rises in...Well if somebody asks me to prove the Sun rises in the East and sets in the West<br />I'm not going to try and prove that. They noticed where the Sun was this morning. I'm not going to play that game.<br />If somebody wants proof that Charlie conspired to murder they can read Helter Skelter. It's an entire book about how a prosecutor got Manson on Conspiracy to murder charges. If they want to disavow the book as fiction then they can read the court transcripts detailing the conspiracy evidence in detail. I'm not going to read it for them mainly because I know they've already read that. They won't admit Charlie's guilt because they need him for they bought what he was selling. They're never going to admit their King has no clothes because their entire world would come to an end. They're having enough trouble having to accept that Nixon was right about Charlie being guilty. They've never gotten over that. They've never gotten over Nixon metaphorically bitch slapping them.MrPoirothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06155552886069024565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-6114011884126776332015-06-16T10:23:19.339-04:002015-06-16T10:23:19.339-04:00And I thought I had already made this clear, but I...And I thought I had already made this clear, but I guess not. The reason I'm not posting his comments has nothing to do with his feelings for Manson, it has to do with his snippy attitude. I know this guy is just trying to start trouble in here. If Lynyrd feels differently and wants to post the guy's comments, fine with me.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-67012992605575593702015-06-16T10:14:02.473-04:002015-06-16T10:14:02.473-04:00Candy I didn't kick anybody out. All I said w...Candy I didn't kick anybody out. All I said was I wasn't going to post his comments, and if Lynyrd wants to he can. I'm not in the mood to fight with this guy, but if others are in the mood have at it...katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-4284662433009569842015-06-16T09:15:14.623-04:002015-06-16T09:15:14.623-04:00Mr P i agree i mean kicking out people now? I like...Mr P i agree i mean kicking out people now? I like this blog, but even at Mansonblog everyone has a say,,,and many like Manson the girls, many dont,,but threatening to kick out and call Lynard on someone,,,omg,,,letme head back to the otherblogs good thing i like Seinfeld or id bekicked out too because half the threads here are Seinfeld quotes and have nothing to do with tlb butwe all have to suffer through itcandy and nutshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01871828104812368464noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-91552642311988951442015-06-16T01:07:53.030-04:002015-06-16T01:07:53.030-04:00Who do you think the people are who don't like...Who do you think the people are who don't like the Helter Skelter motive? It isn't the motive they don't like. Its the fact that Helter Skelter is exactly what got him convicted. They see Helter Skelter as an attack on the counter culture. You have to realize this counter culture crowd lacks a God so they need a Charlie. They need Global Warming and ATWA so they can have something to believe in.MrPoirothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06155552886069024565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-35967471217491703372015-06-16T01:01:14.724-04:002015-06-16T01:01:14.724-04:00Historically there have been many people who sympa...Historically there have been many people who sympathize or empathize or even worship Manson. This isn't restricted to Nobody. For example look at the California Supeme Court back in the day. It was a very pro Manson court. It even overturned every DP verdict in California in order to escape public condemnation it would have received if it had just overthrown Charlie's DP. Charlie had the California Supreme Court on his side. I'm surprised the court judges weren't hanging out at Spahn Ranch. They loved Charlie's counter Christian culture ideology as do many online TLBers like nobody. If you are going to kick out the pro Manson folks then you are basically saying this to 40% of the online TLBers. Even The Col wouldn't be welcomed here.MrPoirothttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06155552886069024565noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-10026327324979496532015-06-15T21:44:33.442-04:002015-06-15T21:44:33.442-04:00Nobody said: As for a defense, he didn't get ...Nobody said: <i>As for a defense, he didn't get one. So that's another problem.</i><br /><br />Whoa Nellie, you just said earlier that he DID get a fair trial. Are you vacillating?? Webster's defines vacillate as: <i>to waver in mind, will, or feeling : hesitate in choice of opinions or course.</i><br /><br />You keep changing streams!! That's why I said earlier that you are talking in circles on purpose.<br /><br />You know Nobody, no one is crying over here. This blog is pretty conservative and I can't speak for everyone on this blog, but I pretty much think that we feel Manson is guilty. If you don't think so that's fine and that's your prerogative. Well, why don't you go to another blog that embraces your theories. Or just open your own blog. Because you're not going to change opinions on this one. As far as I know.<br /><br />This blog has comment moderation, which means anyone who is not a member is subject to moderation, which includes you. I called Lynyrd tonight and left him a message to check the blog. All of which means, I won't be posting any more of your comments because I'm tired of arguing stupid points that seem to go round and round. <br /><br />Having said all that, I'll bid you good night. We'll see what Lynyrd has to say. If you make more comments, they will be in the "holding bin" until he can review them, because frankly, I'm tired of this rat-maze conversation.<br /><br />I wish you well, and have a good night.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-63219905002664582402015-06-15T20:49:52.598-04:002015-06-15T20:49:52.598-04:00I know, I know, I know. He's guilty. But my ...I know, I know, I know. He's guilty. But my question was what proof was presented in the courtroom to prove his guilt, not just "there's evidence" and "there's facts," but actual specific proof, not just he was an asshole, he was acting up in the courtroom, he committed other crimes. I know all that. As for a defense, he didn't get one. So that's another problem. So bottom line, I think it's possible that he was behind it, but I don't think there was sufficient proof to convict much less put him on death row for TLB. But before you start crying again, like I said before, he was guilty in the other two cases.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-1795007656318163292015-06-15T20:19:19.713-04:002015-06-15T20:19:19.713-04:00Nobody, juries can be wrong. Look at the Casey An...Nobody, juries can be wrong. Look at the Casey Anthony trial. But this jury was dead-on right. I agree with Stormy & Dill, the jury heard the testimony and rendered a correct verdict. <br /><br />The jury knew that Susan, Leslie, Pat & Tex killed those people. That is a fact. All they had to determine was if Charlie influenced them to do so. And the evidence was overwhelming to support that. Like I said, the antics in the courtroom proved Charlie was in charge of all of these women. There was absolutely no doubt about it. None!katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-21914985165506316182015-06-15T20:06:10.729-04:002015-06-15T20:06:10.729-04:00I will say this about the TLB jury: They wasted 9...I will say this about the TLB jury: They wasted 9 months of their lives listening to constant interruptions, nonsense and horrific testimony, and were able to render a verdict of guilty, and also a sentence of the death penalty, for all of them, based upon what was presented to them, both orally and visually, in spite of death threats which were issued by Charlie's minions on a constant basis, and continuing on even after they were released from jury duty. They knew that they and their families might face certain death, but were courageous enough to do the right thing. My hat is off to them.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-14085817039328859292015-06-15T20:02:06.383-04:002015-06-15T20:02:06.383-04:00Nobody, not sure how anything I've written in ...Nobody, not sure how anything I've written in this thread would imply that I think Manson's guilt in TLB was an "if." Let me say that I believe his guilt in TLB is anything but an unproven. I believe that the evidence of guilt against Manson and the others was overwhelming and that they all deserved to be sent to prison for the rest of their lives. <br /><br />As to material presented in court, I laid out in my first post in this thread Manson's actions in the LB part of TLB. All of what I said in my first post was presented in court and none of it was ever successfully refuted by the defense. Do you not believe these TLB facts as presented in court or do you believe these TLB facts but just not believe that it should merit a life sentence? Or do you believe something else?Mrstormsurgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08979442670384492209noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-81991970724580132672015-06-15T19:50:17.396-04:002015-06-15T19:50:17.396-04:00Dilligaf, I know, but like I said before, juries c...Dilligaf, I know, but like I said before, juries can be wrong. Convictions get overturned all the time. It's not the fault of the juries. Lawyers play their little games, judges allow or not allow whatever, and the juries have to go based on what they hear in that courtroom, which may or may not be truth, but they assume that it is. So you can't just say, "The jury found him guilty, therefore he is."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-17922567247416959682015-06-15T19:11:40.917-04:002015-06-15T19:11:40.917-04:00It is not a matter of "if" he is guilty....It is not a matter of "if" he is guilty. A superior court jury "did" find that he was guilty, that the legal burden was met for both the Tate & LaBianca murders. That issue was settled...Dilligafhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07052411066646010067noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-32648045137899152092015-06-15T17:54:05.356-04:002015-06-15T17:54:05.356-04:00Yes, I agree, Mrstormsurge. But my question was w...Yes, I agree, Mrstormsurge. But my question was what was the proof presented in the courtroom. But, yes, if he is guilty of TLB, he deserves to be put away, and even if he isn't guilty of TLB, he still deserves to be put away because of his guilt in Shea and Hinman. So I'm not disagreeing with those that say "if" he is guilty.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-69566747315944077802015-06-15T17:24:11.884-04:002015-06-15T17:24:11.884-04:00Katie, as I said before, just because he was guilt...Katie, as I said before, just because he was guilty in two other cases doesn't make him guilty of everything. Each case has to be proven on its own merits.<br /><br />Well, not really. If he is guilty of orchestrating the butchering of two human beings then he deserves to be put away for the rest of his life. Whether he also orchestrated it for five other people is in my humble opinion not needed to put him away until he assumes room temperature and is hauled outta the prison in a body bag. Mrstormsurgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08979442670384492209noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-55605491465280641922015-06-15T16:51:00.088-04:002015-06-15T16:51:00.088-04:00You know Nobody, on second thought, your coming in...You know Nobody, on second thought, your coming in here and calling me names isn't going to work. No one here called you names. It sounds like you're trying to start a fight instead of discussing the case.<br /><br />Clean up your comments or they won't be posted in the future.katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-24072468979804037252015-06-15T16:16:33.911-04:002015-06-15T16:16:33.911-04:00Why don't you read what I wrote and stop makin...Why don't you read what I wrote and stop making assumptions. And you haven't even been near hostile yet...katie8753https://www.blogger.com/profile/00353364961453501063noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6001083595175224919.post-7488470841618885772015-06-15T16:13:38.626-04:002015-06-15T16:13:38.626-04:00Sweetie, calm down. Just read what I wrote and st...Sweetie, calm down. Just read what I wrote and stop making assumptions. I don't know how many times I have to say it. It's really not that complicated. I understand why you're hostile to Manson, but I don't understand why you're hostile to me. I have been respectful so far. May I assume that you like to fight? May I assume that you're not playing with a full deck? Emotional and/or mental problems perhaps? Personality disorder?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com